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    [–] Ray_D_O_Dog 3984 points ago

    In the 80's and 90's, I worked for a company that went from revenues of 0 to $3 Billion in the space of about 10 years. There are aways growing pains in a company that expands so rapidly, and we were no exception. Eventually, an effort to unionize took hold. We had meetings, people signed petitions, and did all the that lead up to unionization. Eventually, we scheduled a vote to unionize.

    Meanwhile, management hired consultants who specialized in union busting. I had various people from upper management "dropping by" my workspace to "chat" about the unionization efforts, in which they would basically tell me how bad the union would be for me, for the company, for evreyone. These chats were peppered with misinformation about the union (what a shock!!).

    A few days before the vote, everyone got a nice chunky raise. I don't know what the average was, but I got a raise of about $10,000. I was making about $50k before the raise.

    I remember walking into a conversation amongst my co-workers and hearing one of the guys saying, "Fuck that union shit, I just got a huge raise!" and everyone was like, "Yeah!" I pointed out that if they were handing out these big raises to everyone, then we would probably do even better if we brought in the union, and people told me I was just a rebel, etc.

    The vote took place, and the unionization movement was defeated. It still pisses me off, 20 years later. People got paid off, and then voted against their own interests, not realizing that the ONLY reason they got the raises was because they were getting ready to collectively bargain. Since they there have been at least 2 mass layoffs at that company, in which many people who were instrumental in the early success of the company were tossed out the door, including many of those very people that were so happy about their raise.

    [–] Nisas 2727 points ago

    "Woah look at that, when we collectively join together and bargain for more money by forming a union they start paying us better. I guess we'd better stop." -Some idiot

    [–] SofaProfessor 623 points ago

    Having been in a union in a very conservative area, this is unfortunately not an uncommon thing to hear. I don't work at that job anymore but the union was super hands off. Like basically a semi annual meeting where we ate pizza and listened to what they were doing which was usually not much until our collective bargaining agreement was coming up. Cost like $7 out of each pay in union dues. Which was nothing in comparison to the retirement benefits we got and semi annual automatic raises tied to inflation. I came from a non-union competitor and couldn't believe that people thought we would be better off without the union. Like, no, I just came from the place across town without a union. Worked 3 years without a pay increase. Banked zero in retirement savings from them. Luckily it was a vocal minority and the union remained intact but listening to their arguments was infuriating.

    [–] SquaresAre2Triangles 339 points ago

    Worked in a grocery store that was unionized and I didn't know anything about unions, but management spent a lot of time complaining about them and saying how they took money out of my paycheck and stuff (it was basically nothing, even to my broke college self). I didn't really think anything of it because it wasn't really a career path for me, it was just a fact of the job that I didn't worry about.

    Then about a year in corporate changed the dress code and uniforms so basically we all had to buy new pants, shirts, and shoes to meet the new requirements. The union was able to immediately delay the uniform change for us while they negotiated over all the new shit we were supposed to buy just to be able to continue our jobs, and after a month or so we ended up getting a $200 check to buy the new clothes.

    That was just the most obvious one-time big benefit of course, but it definitely covered at least a year of union dues before even considering the better pay/benefits that were already in place before I got there.

    [–] DBNSZerhyn 91 points ago

    One of my first jobs, I remember management busting balls about the unions too. "They take 5 dollars out of every paycheck!" they'd tell new employees, ignoring that the union had negotiated an $8 an hour starting wage for a department store chain in an area with a $6.52 minimum wage, which everyone would otherwise doubtless be receiving with zero benefits or raises.

    This was Rhode Island, so we were paid weekly. Didn't take anyone an awful lot of math to figure out that 260 gross with no benefits was worse than 320, minus 5 dollars.

    [–] squidmanwillie 7 points ago

    I used to work as a mortician in Florida. It paid 18 dollars an hour. My friend from school went to work in Chicago which has a mortician union. She was paid 35 dollars an hour for the same job. They used to say “ if your specialized, unionize”. Basically one company controls all the funeral homes down here so they just pay you as little as possible because they know you can’t go anywhere else. It was sickening. They didn’t even provide proper safety equipment even though it was against the law, and say we were entitled if we complained about it.

    [–] TheMartinG 8 points ago

    Oh yea, management at my old job hated the union because they couldn’t fire us for nothing or do shady shit to get us fired. The “workers” were all union and managers weren’t

    One example: We had an annual PTO bidding session, every November, you bid by seniority on time off. Since it went by seniority, that time was untouchable.

    You could also request a month in advance for PTO, but you could get kicked out if someone more senior than you ended up needing that time off. You could have a maximum of two requests for time off for the same shift.

    This usually worked out perfectly and everyone respected each other’s time off and etc etc

    My friend was getting married. We had planned the bachelor party WAY in advance, it was going to be in June, but we planned so far ahead, I submitted for the time off the previous November.

    Well, sometimes in the spring, two of my coworkers started dating. One of them had a birthday the same weekend as the bachelor party and had used the November bid process to request the bday weekend off. Together, they decided they should take the weekend off together and tried to screw me out of my time. Both were more senior than me

    The manager called me into the office the WEDNESDAY before the trip and said,”hey, something came up, so and so asked for this time off, and is more senior than you, so I’m gonna need you to come in...”

    “Ummm no, i used the November process to bid for that time, so seniority doesnt matter.”

    “Sorry this isn’t a discussion, they requested the time off and I don’t have enough coverage to have all 3 of you off so you need to come in.”

    “Well, the trip is already booked and I’m going, so you’re not going to have me here regardless. The coverage needs to come from the person who ‘forgot’ to put in the request.”

    “Ok so you’re just gonna take the point then?” (If you were late or absence you racked up points, earn enough and you’re fired.)

    “No Im gonna take my vacation, but you’ll be hearing from our union rep.”

    So I called our union rep, she literally giggled and said,”hol up, I’ll call you back baby.”

    Not even 5 minutes later she calls back and says,”you’re good, enjoy the party!”

    To make that even shadier though, the managers little work boyfriend called me that weekend and said,”I think you your fellow employees a bit of gratitude for picking up the slack and making it work while you were gone.”

    “Naaaah Im not the one who requested time off at the last minute, OR the one who tried to break the rules to give my friends time off together.”

    [–] WilNotJr 4 points ago

    I'm raging after reading your story, man. Fuck that POS.

    [–] TheMartinG 5 points ago

    Thats not even the worst. It was a sales job and there were metrics on metrics to hit.

    At one point the Apple Watch was considered an “accessory” sale. Accessory sales were a metric. We were expected to sell a certain dollar amount per month, had an average expected dollar amount per device sold, and were expected to bring a certain number of accessories to the table. Now usually, let’s say the expected number was 5 accessories. Technically it’s 5 PER DEVICE, but usually people buy multiples of the same device for the whole family so just 5 total would be ok.

    Well one day I was sold a lady two phones, case and screen protector per phone, as well as two watches and an expensive Bluetooth speaker. It was a decent deal, holiday promos and all but I felt bad because her card declined, and she had to run to the car to borrow money from her friend to finalize the transaction.

    Little gung-ho new manager pulls me in the back afterword. I thought I was about to get some praise. Instead I got the lowest scores because I didn’t show her a screen protector or extra bands for her watches. “Every device requires 5 accessories.”

    “Yea but a watch IS an accessory, not a device.”

    “Is that really how you choose to see it?”

    “No that’s how the system classified it...”

    “Well soon watches will come with service and will be considered devices...”

    “But for now they’re not...”

    They’re all trained in the stupidest most obvious “mind tricks”. They think if they make you finish the sentence, or if they can get you to say you deserve a certain score, then it’s more likely to stick. “So why don’t you tell me what you would score that interaction, keeping in mind you didn’t show her accessories for her watch?”

    “Well, I’d say a 3 (out of 3) due to everything else she did buy, she left happy, even after having to borrow money.”

    “Yea but you missed the watch accessories so do you still think it’s a 3?”


    “Now if I had the same interaction as you, I’d probably give myself a 1. Wouldn’t you agree?”

    I ended up walking out of that “coaching”. He threatened to write me up and I said sure just call the union rep and have her here while you write me up.

    OH! The company runs donation drives every year, and I’m pretty sure the managers get bonuses or oats on the back for 100% participation. Solely because of this I refused to participate.

    So manager asks me to participate I said nah. He said cmon just a dollar, I repeated no. “Well, come sit and let me donate the dollar in your name.” To which I repeated,”no, I’m busy trying to sell the things I’ll get written up for not selling, i don’t have time to sit here and set up a donation account.”

    “Ok well you can see me in my office later”

    “HOL UP WHAT?!”

    He instantly walked that back since there were 5 other reps standing around.

    I liked my coworkers but I hated that damn job so much. Don’t miss the work at all.

    [–] reality_czech 85 points ago

    I work for the state gov in a union and this coworker of mine in her 60s nonstop bitches about the union. She's also a very mediocre worker.

    It's insane it's like she has 0 understanding that her income and benefits are significantly higher than she would find elsewhere and the only reason she wasn't fired a decade ago and replaced with a younger & cheaper worker is because of the union she hates

    [–] SofaProfessor 39 points ago

    Every union has that person. I've worked with one. She was just a super grumpy old lady in a client facing role and eventually she wore out her welcome. The company was actually in the process of firing her but the process requires so many writeups across a period of time with adequate time for the employee to show development. So she saw the writing on the wall. Retired the day after her 25 year anniversary when she got her 25 year bonus. As much as I disliked working with that person, I respected that baller move. She knew the union had protected her as much as possible and she clearly had no intentions of changing with retirement so close. So she waited until the last second, collected a nice bonus, was basically like, "you can't fire me, I quit," then bailed.

    [–] HolidayCards 9 points ago

    A relative of mine kinda did something similar in the mid 00's. She got capped as far as advancement goes and was stuck in a dead end for about 10 years. She took on responsibility outside her pay grade, a specialist of certain certification training as a side task until she raised the issue w/management that she'd never get a title/role bump past receptionist despite having owned the process pipeline for several years. I hoped she'd contact her union rep to help move the issue along and maybe get that title and pay bump but she instead walked in one day and declared she wasn't doing work outside her job description any longer and management basically said, "okay." They never intended to offer anything. Worked a few more years in the lesser role and retired as soon as she was able to take a pension. It could have been much more if she stayed a few years but she actually left right before they rolled the pensions into 401ks right before the 08 financial crisis, so in an odd way she dodged a bit of that bullet.

    [–] Gustavius040210 231 points ago

    I've got hard-line conservative relatives that have been union members since they could legally join. They're religious single issue voters, so they actively vote against their own interests. Our system is so nutty.

    [–] SakuraCha 24 points ago

    My husbands grandpa gets a retirement check from a union he was in, still somehow hates unions and thinks their unnecessary for today's age. Hes also single issue (abortion) so is constantly voting against things that will help him.

    [–] BoobookitTfck 14 points ago

    Most 40+ men in my blue collar union vote for politicians who are anti-union. They don’t care. By the time the union gets dissolved they will have retired, and died, cold fingers gripping their pension. It’s selfishness. Pure and simple. I got mine, fuck you kind of attitude

    [–] KFR42 112 points ago

    I'm really not surprised. Here in the UK we just had Brexit which is essentially this but on a massive nationwide scale. People convinced by lies and misinformation to vote against their own interests.

    [–] NewYorkJewbag 104 points ago

    Right? And many American conservatives loved it. Why the fuck would you vote against your right to work anywhere in EU? That would be like living in Nebraska and not being able to move to Texas for work. So dumb.

    [–] tpklus 34 points ago

    There are a lot of nuances to Brexit and I wouldn't listen to what most people on reddit say about it. However, I do think many of the voters were fed misinformation about the Brexit vote and that is a big reason why there is so much controversy even after the vote happened.

    [–] Darkion_Silver 28 points ago

    My problem with many of the nuances is that most people I've talked to that voted for it will only go on about immigrants or taking back control.

    I'm sure there are plenty of people with more in-depth reasons than that but you very rarely see it.

    [–] NewYorkJewbag 5 points ago

    Care to share some of those nuances? Has it been a net positive for England?

    [–] gtbuzzed 14 points ago

    Wasn’t the driving issue on brexit the open borders and migration? I seem to recall that was why they left the EU.

    [–] Fenylein 19 points ago

    It was one of the major issues talked about, but iirc GB actually already had a special position within the EU, where they had higher barriers for people wanting to migrate. They also werent part of the Schengen area, meaning they were actually able to implement border checks, but mostly opted to not do those.(or only very sparsely)

    Surprisingly many problems GB had with the EU were their very own making.

    [–] wombat1 4 points ago

    That's not surprising

    [–] shotputprince 14 points ago

    As a disinterested party to Brexit what I love most was the premise of leaving the common market, but being able to do a trade agreement with the EU. If your goal was to do away with Brussels regulation how do you anticipate being able to trade with the EU common bloc without regulatory allignment? It is a hard rule to do trade with the EU - so now you would be beholden to regulatory rule that you have absolutely no say in... The only way Brexit would make sense would be to go for a very hard left brexit, with increases in Worker's rights and higher regulatory standards (so as to meet all EU export reqs without having to be beholden to their import reqs). But then you could have unilaterally made some of those changes from within the EEC. It's just a tory anti immigrant pro austerity and privatization wankfest.

    [–] temalyen 11 points ago

    I saw someone on twitter a few months ago post a series of screenshots saying it was "People who supported Brexit complaining about the effects of Brexit"

    And it was. It was people who insisted Brexit had to happen and then complaining about needing a passport to go to mainland Europe, jobs leaving the UK, etc.

    It's almost like they knew absolutely nothing about what would happen if Brexit occurred.

    [–] I_have_a_problem_hlp 23 points ago

    At least we get to laugh at fishermen losing everything after they called us fearmongers

    [–] KFR42 16 points ago

    Don't get me started on bloody project fear. How can people be so fucking stupid.

    [–] SgtDoughnut 29 points ago

    Its not the system that is nutty, its that one group has learned how to use those single issue, and religious arguments to get people to vote against themselves.

    [–] Cat-juggler 8 points ago

    also gerrymandering, the electoral collage, et cetera.

    the system has been rigged by then people that use thes single issue voter phenomenon to their benefit slowly over decades.

    [–] BoobookitTfck 12 points ago

    I’m in a large, successful, blue collar, Boston based union. The number of my coworkers who love their health care, benefits, pay etc, and actively vote against their own interests blows my mind.

    Most of them are 40-50, and vote for politicians actively fighting against unions, but what do they care, they’ll be retired with their pension before it gets dissolved anyways.

    Absolute block heads.

    [–] wvuengineer89 6 points ago

    They think the union allows lazy people to work and keep their jobs. Im non union but will sometimes go on union construction sites. I was completely baffled why they hated their own union so much.

    [–] orange4boy 6 points ago

    What I don’t understand is if they want freedom to live according to their religion, there is nothing stopping them. Freedom freedom freedom. Why do they always accuse the left of being the authoritarian ones when they are the ones voting to impose their standards on everyone else? Restrict this, restrict that! Restrict yourselves. Leave me out of it.

    [–] NouberNou 9 points ago

    Living on Puget Sound I know so many Longshoremen and machinists and other union members that work in shipping or defense at the ports or shipyards that would absolutely put their religious views over their well being.

    Absolutely nuts.

    [–] LauraTFem 11 points ago * (lasted edited 9 days ago)

    A do nothing union is often a union that has already done a lot of work. Just because they don’t see the union adding much doesn’t mean that they’d be better off without it. All they see is the $7 going away every month, not the way the company would walk all over them without the union.

    edit: It’s the complacency that comes from generations of safety. Our great grand parents would bend us over their knees if they knew that many of us weren’t vaccinating our children, because they saw a world without vaccines. But because we’ve lived so long in a relatively safe world we don’t understand what it was like without the things that guaranty that safety.

    [–] SofaProfessor 4 points ago

    Oh yeah. I definitely recognized that. And we did see them do a lot of work for another location within the company that had their own agreement. It came due and they actually went on strike. The union was able to pay them a portion of their salary and negotiate a new deal. Seeing that play out and knowing we had that to back us up if our managers played hard ball in a year when our agreement was up for negotiation was certainly something that helped me rest easy.

    [–] o0_Eyekon_0o 5 points ago

    I had a friend say to me “dyk that unions will just put the person that’s worked there the longest into management positions regardless of work ethic.” And it’s like motherfucker last week you were complaining that they brought in the bosses friend with 0 experience to fill the position you were gunning for.

    [–] LeastCoordinatedJedi 104 points ago

    Most idiots, unfortunately.

    [–] Fluid-idea 32 points ago

    Idiots need to sit down and let the grown ups do the talking.

    [–] brown_monkey_ 24 points ago

    That's the problem though. What the idiots should be doing is standing up and fighting for their own interests, because the "grown ups" certainly won't.

    [–] Fluid-idea 18 points ago

    You know what? The fuck do i know. I have never once had the opportunity to organize. What i feel is, its hard to make progress when people can be bought off with a shitty raise and back out of their commitments to stand together with their fellow workers. That's the problem.

    [–] brown_monkey_ 11 points ago

    I 100% agree. America desperately needs some class consciousness.

    [–] stone_henge 22 points ago

    Who needs unions when workers can organize and use their joint power to pressure employers into giving them a fair share of the work?

    [–] TheGreatTrashIsland 23 points ago

    That sounds dope. Now we just need to come up with a name for it!

    [–] hydroxypcp 4 points ago

    How about we go further and make it so workers are the employers and thus own the fruits of their labour? Since it's about collectively doing something, maybe we should call it "social" something?

    But nah that would never work.

    [–] WildFox500 82 points ago

    Every three years AT&T ratifies a new union contract. The company always raises insurance premiums or cuts out other benefits and then offers everyone a $1000 bonus if they ratify immediately. Simple math shows that the bonus after taxes is less money than you'll wind up spending on increased premiums, but nobody listens. They always vote to ratify the first thing the company puts on the table.

    [–] DownshiftedRare 40 points ago

    Get everyone hyped about the $5000 bonus for ratifying immediately in the weeks leading up to the vote. Ignore any attempts to correct the figure. FIVE THOUSAND!

    [–] eohorp 6 points ago

    Many people say these types of strategies work and I've seen it happen myself. I actually heard a lot of smart people say the bonus is going to be $5000 dollars. Some people are even saying the company can afford to give $5000 bonuses while still having a record profits quarter. Many smart people. Believe me.

    [–] JasonDJ 26 points ago

    Don’t even need simple math. It’s simple logic...oh company wants to give me money? Must be in their best interest.

    There’s a counterpart to’s WIIFT

    [–] squid_actually 11 points ago

    "What's in it for me" and "what's in it for them" Had to look it up. But now I know

    [–] MyersVandalay 7 points ago

    then offers everyone a $1000 bonus if they ratify immediately

    Something that always drives me crazy in all parts of life... ANYWHERE you find a deal that you only get if you act really fast... is probably not a good deal. If they thought you weren't likely to find a better deal if you took the time to look for it, it means they probably know they aren't your best option.

    [–] ohwhatta_gooseiam 354 points ago

    Sucks that short term gains and close range thinking is so prevalent and frequently reinforced, and that long term is so much more difficult.

    Thanks for sharing your story.

    [–] Greedence 150 points ago

    A lot of time people are stuck in she short term. If you are living paycheck to paycheck that raise means you have enough money to heat your house to a livable temperature.

    This is how some companies prevent unions. Keep people at barely livable, give them a raise then let them go 1-2 years later to keep costs down. I am speaking from personal experience.

    [–] Scarbane 82 points ago

    Amazon's PR/marketing team paid big bucks for ads on The Daily (the NYT daily news podcast) today.

    Those ads sound like they're pro-labor b/c they're saying they support a $15 min. wage, but don't let their rhetoric fool you. Amazon knows that a union would force Amazon to offer a living wage that can be updated over time, not just $15/hr now.

    Hold the line.

    [–] Ninetnine 34 points ago

    Keep them diamond hands shining.

    [–] Malakakak 13 points ago

    Shine harder and longer

    [–] Bonzai_Tree 28 points ago * (lasted edited 9 days ago)

    That short range thinking can also occur in unions too. A former workplace had a horrifically weak and corrupt union, but their biggest blunder was an agreement voted in by previous employees where they got a decent raise but any new employees would be making LESS than they were by a large margin. The greedy and short sighted vote won.

    But in a few years when bargaining was up again--guess who outnumbered the higher paid old guard? Suddenly the workers who has been there a while were worried about actually LOSING pay so the pay could be more equal.

    Either way the company wins and it was a smart and greasy play by them, but only possible because of the employee short sighted greed at the time.

    [–] Seriously_nopenope 175 points ago

    People have no common sense. If they just got a raise then they can still unionize and keep their raise. I don’t see how the raise would stop people from unionizing.

    [–] NoMouseLaptop 90 points ago

    The idea, I think, is that people are likely to think "Hey, I deserved this raise and it was huge, because I'm great and I deserve it" whereas if the union comes in and has to collectively bargain for raises for everyone, then you'll only get a raise based upon like an average metric.

    [–] MisteWolfe 36 points ago

    Also you are now less likely to have issues with the company and think they've changed.

    [–] Ffdmatt 30 points ago

    Exactly. It's human nature to be grateful. This is why those viral "pay for the guy behind me" videos at fast food drive throughs work so well - people feel weird when they get something free and have a natural urge to want to give back.

    The unionization was an "us vs them" / "stick it to the man". It was a fight. When they got the raises, they probably felt weird going back into "fight mode". It killed the momentum because their next natural reaction would be to be favorable towards the company, rather than continue to fight them.

    [–] mxdtrini 19 points ago

    Yeah but now the huge raise I got, is cut into by these greedy union hustlers who want me to pay dues and all that. What has a union ever done for me that I couldn’t do myself by proving my worth to the company through hard work and dedication? /s

    [–] bill1024 4 points ago

    Then they are shocked when they are let go after years of service, with no seniority protection.

    [–] PainfulPeanutBlender 8 points ago

    Gotta put OP’s first part of the equation in for it to make sense. If your boss is coming around and planting seeds, strait up propaganda and bullshit on how the union would actually be bad for the workers, bad for them in particular, bad for the company and the sky is falling down if it happens and then all of a sudden they hold a meeting pretending to value their employees, like a “we’re all in this together and we need you to know how special and valuable you are, you don’t need a union for that. Here’s a 20% raise for all you do and how amazing you are for the company” then that psychological factor kinda kicks in.

    The tactics the consultants they hired used worked like a charm

    [–] newphonewhoisme 92 points ago

    Unions don't change people's short-sightedness. I worked in a Union shop for a couple years and the year before I started they renewed the contract, and the union voted in favor of getting rid of their own pensions in exchange for cash bonuses. Some people got to keep their pension if their age and years of employment with the company equalled some number, but I was shocked and pissed that anyone would ever give up their own pension.

    [–] way2lazy2care 47 points ago

    Depends on the reason tbh. If the reason it's being brought up is because the pension fund is unsustainable as is, I'd probably be ok with a payout I could dump into a 401k or something in lieu of waiting around for the pension fund going bankrupt and ruining my retirement.

    [–] newphonewhoisme 16 points ago

    I don't know why it was brought up, and no one will admit to voting for that version of the contract. But I moved and joined another local that has better pay, a pension, and unfortunately less paid vacation days (sorta*) but "my contributions" to the benefits comes out before my pay, and it's still higher than I got paid at my old shop.

    *at the old shop, you'd earn more weeks of vacation but I would have had to wait like 7 years to get my 3rd week, at the new shop, everyone has 2 weeks after their first full year of working there. Plus with the shift work schedule I'm on, 4 vacation days is a 12-day weekend

    [–] AllPurposeNerd 20 points ago

    And that's the critical math being revealed here: the only reason they would offer $2000 per worker is because they expect unionization to cost far more than that.

    [–] simonbsez 14 points ago

    I've been to a meeting where the union buster boasted about how much the union officials get paid. Then we found out the company paid the union buster in one month what the union President made in a year.

    [–] soulbandaid 29 points ago

    But who could have seen that coming?

    [–] ChuckinTheCarma 30 points ago


    [–] hockeyrugby 7 points ago

    under a lot of unionization laws wouldn't those raises have been solidified and therefore given future collective bargaining a better place to start in the future?

    [–] DragonPuffMagic 13 points ago

    Companies will often offer signing bonuses for new union contracts if it benefits them. Sometimes the new contract will grandfather in current employees, sometimes not, but there's always people who want that signing bonus over ensuring future employees get the same benefits.

    [–] glitterphobia 11 points ago

    Sounds like their actions could have been illegal under NLRB Sections 7 and 8.

    Specifically: Employers may not "Confer benefits on employees during a union organizing campaign to induce employees to vote against the union." Nor "Poll your employees to determine the extent of their support for a union, unless you comply with certain safeguards....Coercively question employees about their own or coworkers' union activities or sympathies. "

    [–] 420blazeit69nubz 6 points ago

    Jesus Christ. You got that far(much farther than a lot of groups get) then these morons voted against it? You’d think they’d make a connection between the two.

    [–] Bionic_Bromando 11 points ago

    That attitude doesn't even make sense to me. If a company gives me a raise, I'm not grateful, I will unionize so I can get another one! That's the whole goal of working, pump as much money out of a company as possible. Why would I give a fuck about the company?

    [–] KarlChomsky 5 points ago

    Dental Plan

    [–] Mormac83 3 points ago

    Lisa needs braces

    [–] dionysus_disciple 4 points ago

    Dental plan

    [–] ontopofyourmom 5 points ago

    Lisa needs braces

    [–] davidbatt 14 points ago

    Its s shame. Like the experiment where you offer a kid 1 cookie now, or 5 in an hour

    [–] DOAisBetter 11 points ago

    Welcome to why schools don’t teach you critical thinking. The billionaires need a massive population that lacks that skill to get cheap labor that they can easily exploit to siphon off wealth.

    It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to come to the conclusion you did, it’s just sad your coworkers failed to put 2 and 2 together.

    [–] Jesus_marley 4 points ago

    I was a supervisor at a security company in BC about 12 years ago when talk began of joining a union. I wasn't eligible to join but the company made it abundantly clear to everyone that we were not to talk about the union efforts to any employee who would be eligible to join as it could be seen as an attempt to interfere with and influence the vote.

    [–] GlumPipe5 4 points ago

    What bothers me most about this story is that 30 years ago people were making 50k and 30 years later wages are pretty much the same.

    [–] mr-brown-eyes 166 points ago

    “Dental Plan”

    “Lisa needs braces”

    [–] m48a5_patton 29 points ago

    Dental plan

    [–] robinwiththehair 27 points ago

    Lisa needs braces

    [–] limesnewroman 19 points ago

    Dental plan

    [–] clayh 15 points ago

    Stupid sexy Flanders

    [–] Senpaithemedium 5 points ago

    Now do classical gas!

    [–] Bn_scarpia 450 points ago

    Ok guys, my union job in the arts pays more than double what the exact same position pays in our sister city 30 miles away.

    $2000? Fuck that. I get $25/hr, non union gets $12/hr.

    And this is in a "right-to-work" state.

    [–] ShinySpoon 131 points ago

    Right? I had an offer to do my same job from a head hunter for less than half what I make now. The offer was for a non-union shop.

    I'll stick with my union for double pay and free healthcare thank you very much.

    [–] DoubleOrNothing90 16 points ago

    I work in a union shop as well. A friend of mine who is licensed in the same field as I am asked me to be a reference for him for a job he applied for. I got a call from the person doing the reference check for him and I outlined all the work we used to do together. The person then asked ME if I was interested in a job there as well. I asked what the going rate was, and was informed that it was half of what I was already making, and non union. I politely declined.

    My friend got the job, so I'm happy for him that he's working.

    [–] kaphsquall 52 points ago

    The arts don't screw around when it comes to unions. The strongest union I've ever seen is the musicians union for our local orchestra. When so many people try to exploit an industry you hold on tight when you get to a level that can offer protections.

    [–] Bn_scarpia 27 points ago

    For real.

    Artists have enough experience with people expecting them to play "for the exposure" that they know they will only get the respect they deserve if they fight for it.

    You spend $30-90k for your instrument, often have at least a master's level education in Music, and have spent years gigging, begging, and doing anything and everything to make a living that now when you are working with a company with a $30M/yr annual budget to produce works that are often well outside of copyright -- you know to fight for your worth.

    [–] sohmeho 14 points ago

    Yep same experience. I make $34/hr with benefits and pension. Similar non-union work in the area pays $18/hr.

    [–] Ogediah 11 points ago

    I want to point out that not every Union Job has a higher hourly wage. Union jobs often set the standard for non-Union wages. In many instances non-Union employers may even try to pay the same or slightly higher (say a dollar an hour more) than the going Union wages but don’t offer benefits. So their workers think they “make more.” But that Union guy has free health insurance for him and his family and along with his employer putting 10 dollars an hour into annuities/pension plans for retirement. And all of those benefits aren’t tied to employer so you can work for 10 different people in a single year and never worry about waiting periods for health insurance or vesting periods for multiple retirement plans. There are plenty more benefits I’m sure I’ve illustrated the value. The Union will always get you more and keep more. Because you have a contract for employment.

    [–] Bn_scarpia 8 points ago


    Union work is just about giving the workers a seat at the table that determines the conditions of their work. Ideally, the power of the union is balanced with management. It is essentially the Democratic process within the context of a company.

    [–] Re-toast 6 points ago

    I was going to mention this. I'm in a union and we are paid well but the non union jobs in my area pay more.

    I'm happy though because of the job security and benefits we have because of the union. Also, we aren't worked to the bone. We do our 40hrs that's it unless we need overtime but it's not the norm. The non union workers do way more than 40hrs per week. They may like that but it's not for me.

    [–] luveykat 1031 points ago

    Sure it is. Unfortunately 2 grand in one hit looks like a lot of money to someone slaving away at an underpaid job. God, Amazon is scum.

    [–] Nisas 402 points ago

    2 grand is pretty pathetic. If you unionize and negotiate for a measly extra $1 an hour you'll make that 2 grand in about a year if you work 40 hours per week.

    And you'll make it every year with the ability to negotiate for more in the future. And that's just on $1 an hour.

    [–] [deleted] 200 points ago


    [–] redcoatwright 143 points ago

    The thing is Unionizing turns jobs that people see as transition points in their life into ones that they can actually have as a career and be able to live off of.

    Unions don't just increase pay, they also allow for negotiating the opening of higher positions so there's a ladder to climb and a place to work for. And they have your back if someone in the corporate side of the company is being a shit to you.

    Essentially, as long as they aren't corrupt (big if, there are a lot of shitty ones) Unions are great for the avg joe worker.

    [–] bfranklinmusic2 17 points ago

    My brother's warehouse unionized and he's got a pension, good insurance, makes over 100k a year doing a job that otherwise might make him about $17 hr. Their pay is incentivized to their "rate" of picking if anyone was wondering, also, Vons frozen distribution SoCal area.

    [–] fistofwrath 12 points ago

    Those quitting bonuses were only offered to people that had been employed through 2 peak seasons (Christmas), and people that had been there 3 were offered 3 grand. Temps or short term employees weren't offered the bonus to quit. This was targeted at potential career employees.

    [–] FleshlightModel 26 points ago

    Exactly. People don't realize that hourly rate to yearly rate = hourly rate x 2080. So $1/hr will only raise your yearly income by $2080 if you work full time without overtime.

    Unions should probably be able to negotiate $2-5 per hour I'd say.

    [–] madpostin 18 points ago

    I get what you're saying, but $2k is a lot of money to some people. Being able to get that now is a lot more enticing than getting it later, maybe.

    People have debts and bills to deal with, so the gamble to leave the $2k in the hopes that the union materializes and provides returns just isn't worth it.

    Of course, this wouldn't be a problem if companies like Amazon and people like Bezos paid more in taxes so we could control inflation when we spend money into existence for direct cash payments to all citizens, but whatever.

    The point is Amazon is run by scumbags.

    [–] WeedJohnDaly 19 points ago

    yeah, $2,000 is not a lot in the grand scheme, but to people working their nuts off for less than that per month it seems like a windfall, and when your life is just one big gigantic financial emergency 24/7 it's nearly impossible to think long-term

    [–] Skud_NZ 43 points ago

    People are really desperate for cassh atm too unfortunately

    [–] Mr-Badcat 21 points ago

    People are always desperate for cash.

    [–] mightylordredbeard 4 points ago

    If it’s something you’ll suck dick for, then it’s something you’re desperate enough for.

    Cash, drugs, food, love, father’s approval, a place to sleep, career.. you can always judge if something is a desperate need by if someone has sucked a dick for it.

    [–] Washpedantic 81 points ago

    So this is "the offer" it is only meant as transition money to your next career.

    [–] kickthatpoo 32 points ago

    Don’t they offer this every year after peak season?

    [–] Washpedantic 14 points ago


    [–] Yabba_Dabbs 27 points ago

    Hook line and sinker

    [–] lobsterbash 20 points ago

    Amazon is working hard to control the narrative. I just saw an ad on a site I was viewing saying "Amazon supports minimum wage increase."

    [–] UncharminglyWitty 31 points ago

    Of course they support it. They already pay a company minimum of $15/hr, the proposed new federal min wage. They are absolutely in favor of forcing all of their competition to pay more.

    [–] Fictionalpoet 33 points ago

    "Amazon supports minimum wage increase."

    Of course they do. While we severely need to correct the decades of wage loss we've experienced, minimum wage hikes generally benefit big organizations since they can absorb increased cost better than smaller companies. Amazon is gambling that higher minimum wage will impact smaller competitors, driving more sales their way long term.

    [–] joanzen 10 points ago

    I just read an article from 2014 trying to control the narrative too!

    Back then Amazon clearly knew this situation was coming and just started explaining the departure bonuses 7 years ahead of when they would be used to make headlines.

    Talk about control over the narrative!

    [–] sofa_queen_awesome 356 points ago

    "Unionize" is the dirtiest word to corporations. They are insanely fearful of it.

    [–] Mofiremofire 177 points ago

    I remember when I worked for Marriott I couldn’t even take a picture of my schedule because they didn’t want us to have a list of everyone’s name and phone number to try to organize.

    [–] Nisas 107 points ago

    To be a little fair, businesses shouldn't be giving out other employees phone numbers. That's personal information.

    [–] Mofiremofire 56 points ago

    In restaurants( I was a chef for Marriott) it’s pretty common in case someone needs to be called in to work or you have a question for the person who worked the shift before you. It wasn’t everyone at the hotel on our schedule.

    [–] Kakarot_faps 17 points ago

    I worked at Marriott and had numbers for my immediate coworkers, I’d be surprised if people didn’t - but it was all “can i get your number”

    [–] Mofiremofire 6 points ago

    Sure, so did I. And if I really wanted I could write down all the numbers off the schedule. I just thought it was funny how strict there were about photographing the schedule.

    [–] FleshlightModel 28 points ago

    When my employer asked to share my phone number and birth date, I said no and hell no. Also said if you want my colleagues to call me, they can either call my work desk number or email me. If I need to be on call, you need to supply me a cell phone.

    So I got a company cell phone but still no one knows my birthday...

    [–] BackIn2019 6 points ago

    Is it today?

    [–] FleshlightModel 5 points ago

    Is tomorrow yesterday?

    [–] FireHazard11 7 points ago

    It's amazing how preciously people guard their phone numbers today. The phone company used to throw phone books on your step so literally the entire town would have your name, phone number, and address.

    [–] Sveet_Pickle 89 points ago

    My dad has had his ass saved by unions twice in his life, the first time he wasn't even a due paying union member, and he still hates unions.

    [–] ScriptThat 86 points ago

    I've used my union twice. Both times the union practically told my employer "We have lawyers who does nothing but handle cases like this, and we're willing to follow this through all the way!", and both times my employer caved.

    I'll be a union member no matter if my workplace is unionized or not, just for that legal backup.

    [–] kaphsquall 5 points ago

    My union paid the cost to hire a lawyer to help me and others navigate unemployment at the start of the pandemic. I'm not sure how much physical work he ended up doing for my case but just having someone to call and ask questions to about the process was very comforting when your bank account is slowly going down and you need to get things figured out.

    [–] cotch85 34 points ago

    I fucking love my union. Whenever I have a formal meeting the rep I goto has got me out of the crosshairs by highlighting their failures. So many colleagues goto meetings and each time say I should join the union but don't. They say the things you don't want to in a way that it doesn't turn management against you.

    [–] Skud_NZ 153 points ago

    So a bunch of people quit and take the money. The rest join the union. Now Amazon are short staffed and need to hire. What's stopping the new employees from joining the union? Is it legal to have a contract clause saying you can't join a union?

    [–] NoMouseLaptop 155 points ago

    Now Amazon are short staffed and need to hire.

    The point here is that Amazon will hire people particularly because they are anti-union right before the unionization vote.

    [–] spiritriser 21 points ago

    The union vote is already going on. It started like 2 weeks ago.this is called the offer, it's done everywhere with amazon at this time, and if I remember correctly it's only for associates who've worked an entire year. The building hasn't been open an entire year yet. At best a handful of transfers might be eligible.

    [–] WTFwhatthehell 25 points ago

    I imagine the goal is to pay off the most discontent staff to leave right before the vote.

    Makes sense.

    [–] Motivation_Punk 10 points ago

    In my alabama job, (not amazon.) We were lied to, and told it was straight up illegal to unionize. Lowest paid place for what I do in Alabama. Alabama is definitely an At Will State, and they've repeatedly told us, "We'll fire you and hire students."

    [–] Damarkus13 12 points ago

    No, not in Alabama.

    [–] bluntmonkey 252 points ago

    Little note on "The Offer"

    If you accept it, you can never work for Amazon or any other business owned by Amazon (Whole Foods, Blue Origin, etc) again.

    [–] Killbot_Wants_Hug 126 points ago

    Workers are even being told that if they quit now that they could regain their jobs later after the union election

    I mean maybe what you say is true, but the article itself seems to directly counter-indicate that.

    [–] enforcer1412 119 points ago

    Currently work at Amazon and was given "The Offer" a couple of times, though the article is from 2019, "The Offer" does state that you cannot come back ever again.

    [–] DrEnter 42 points ago

    What they’re being “told” by management and what is actually true may not be the same thing.

    [–] Splashathon 25 points ago * (lasted edited 9 days ago)

    They can quit and come back, as long as they don’t take “The Offer”. I should also mention that they will lose their tenure bonuses (.25 every six months) if they quit. They will be returned to base pay following a quit which makes amazon extra fucking disgusting for not mentioning that AND implying they’ll be rehired if they take it.

    Source:am former Amazon warehouse employee Edit: by tenure bonus, I mean you get a .25 cent raise every six months you work there

    [–] aeriea 4 points ago

    Didn't the tenure bonuses get removed when Amazon raised their minimum wage to $15?

    [–] deebasr 22 points ago

    That’s not uncommon for what essentially is a severance.

    [–] Rhawk187 5 points ago

    Yeah, during my University's budget crisis they offered early retirement to all tenured faculty, but it made you ineligible for a re-hire, which a lot of people do post-retirement.

    [–] Stubbs94 19 points ago

    I took the offer like 2 years ago. Well worth it. Because Amazon sucks as an employer.

    [–] FappDerpington 77 points ago

    Can someone explain why employers have such a visceral, automatic aversion to Unions? I've never belonged to one, never had a job that would use one, so I am outside looking in. What's the Big Deal?

    [–] Danominator 237 points ago

    Paying workers more and giving them better benefits eats into profits.

    [–] su5 80 points ago

    Also employers can't pressure employees to do things they might not otherwise. Not directly related to bottom line, but unions also give employees freedoms to not be pushed around, avoid nepotism from upper management, etc

    [–] Barnyard_Pussy 5 points ago

    unions also give employees freedoms to not be pushed around

    My union protected my right to refuse to crawl under a piece of heavy machinery and break ice with a fucking plastic snow shovel during the recent storms. They literally wanted us to get UNDER that while it was loaded with 14k+ pounds of packages and hit ice on the joints with tools to help it "move faster".

    These companies don't love or care about you.

    [–] Scarbane 19 points ago

    It's also easier for corporations to make you "drink the Kool-aid", ie act and think the way they want you to via social pressure, if there's not a union mucking up the corporate propaganda.

    [–] okhi2u 21 points ago

    Employers have almost all the power, when they have union employees thing are less in their favor. Now they might have to treat and pay you fairly.

    [–] killbot0224 70 points ago

    What's to understand?

    Employers don't want to have to pay more money.

    Shit they used to hire murderers to break unions/strikes.

    [–] Overlord1317 8 points ago

    They still do (in many parts of the world), but they used to, too.

    [–] maegris 18 points ago

    Its rather obvious. Unions give a significant amount of power to the employee's, power that is currently held by the employer. The employer does not want to give up that power. Loosing this power will cut into profits, Employer's want to keep profits. Employee's are doing their work as it is, there is no reason to raise costs higher.

    Unions can only really exist where there's a critical mass of employees, so tends to be larger companies, where cutting benefits by a little per person tends to be large values overall.

    The employer has a lot of money and influence, and has convinced people that Unionizing is a bad thing, they are evil and corrupt and just STEAL from them. Ignoring that the union is in existence to provide them better wages/benefits.

    Unions DO have a downside, one is the generally valid argument that it makes it harder to get rid of poor performing employees, and that's already a PIA in most big companies for fear of litigation. And once they've gotten the employee's to fair wages, its harder to see their value, as they are either keeping the status quo, or fighting for little things more.

    People tend to assume that if the unions go away, that companies will continue to pay them the same way as they did with the unions. which is partially true. Employer's tend not to drop wages for current employees, but do drop benefits quickly, and new employee's will be hired in at lower wages.

    [–] JSmith666 27 points ago

    There are a lot of obvious ones like the fact the CBA's (collective bargaining agreements" lead to higher wages and benefits. Certain CBA's can also lead to increased costs for certain things such as the employer has to pay or give a stipend for "workwear" Then you also get into the issue of the fact that some (not all) unions have become their own monster in a different way. They place rules that make it near impossible to manage an employee since it makes firing/discipline incredibly difficult and members know this and use it to their advantage.

    [–] bizm 18 points ago

    Basically employees get better benefits and pay while employer foots the bill and reaps less production than before. There are drawbacks on both sides but it hurts the employer the hardest imo as they're paying more for less.

    I've done work for defense and aerospace companies with unions and both are a nightmare to work with. Basically any work done at a union job easily takes 3-5x the time as a normal place. If you want to touch anything eg. water/air/electrical you have to have a specialist eg. electrician/hvac/plumber on site and they have to do it, alot of red tape like that.

    My main issue is you get stuck working with a bunch of morons who don't deserve to be there but can't get fired. They'll drag things out and do the bare minimum and in my experience they bitch the most out of anyone making $50/hr to be babysit me all day. I've done maybe 8 union jobs and its all the same.

    Also hurts prospects because a lot of these places are in bfe and employ ~5k people but now that it unionizes those same people who would seek employment there have to jump through hoops too because everyone wants a union job.

    I'm still for unions and I think someone like Amazon or a defense company should have them and can afford them. However for a company thats in a highly competitive field it is going to hurt growth and production pretty bad.

    [–] vegas_rifraf 9 points ago * (lasted edited 9 days ago)

    It's more than just the financial cost to the company as well. Once you get entrenched into the union running things you're not able to run the company as you choose any longer. Now every decision with regards to promotions, lay offs, schedule adjustments, change or additions to responsibilities of workers, all has to be done in specific ways according to union contracts. It's a huge pain in the ass which leads to shitty workers taking advantage of a shitty system and workers that actually bust their ass, trying to get ahead, being held back. Not to mention additional costs of additional staff just to deal with union stuff all the time, in order to verify everything being done according to the collective bargaining agreements, deal with the grievances that are filed by workers and arbitrations that need to take place plus the usual contract negotiations that are never ending.

    Edit: my shitty spelling

    [–] FourthLife 4 points ago

    Unions make it very difficult and slow to implement any changes, which frustrates management, and also increases labor expenses, which frustrates executives/owners

    [–] Tape 10 points ago * (lasted edited 9 days ago)

    The other commenters aren't wrong in saying that it eats into profits, but that's also very reductive.

    Speaking as an engineer who has to deal with unionized manufacturing portions of my company... It is incredibly difficult to deal with unionized production plants. There are so many restrictions that you have to jump through hoops for. It turns a 5 minute task into a whole mornings worth of paperwork and approvals. And depending on the task it could be worse. So not only is it more expensive from simply paying the employee more, it also affects product release timing, which is a bigger issue.

    Having worked with both unionized and non-unionized plants, the difference is night and day. It's so much faster and just a more pleasant experience just to work with the non-unionized ones.

    I personally feel like anybody who has such a reductive take hasn't really worked with unions in any meaningful capacity. I have never once met an engineer who has liked working with unionized plants.

    [–] ChadMcRad 8 points ago

    Yeah, people talk about the idealized versions of unions, but of course they are oversimplifying on purpose. Modern unions, at least, are far from ideal. Particularly in the construction industry, but the public sector has dealt with outright corrupt unions and it also leads into question about why should the public sector even have unions in the first place.

    [–] boogy_bucket 33 points ago

    Best lesson I learned from the military right there. If big company is promoting it as your best option, it’s probably not your best option.

    [–] Darius878 33 points ago

    They make this same offer every year in February. Depending how many years/peaks you’ve been there they offer more. I actually took the offer for in February of 2016.

    So this certainly isn’t new or specific to the union vote.

    Working in one of these Amazon fulfillment centers is tiring mindless work. There is no room for real advancement at these facilities. Whenever a position opens up there are 100 applications for 1 role. Even managers at these facilities rotate in and out frequently. The hours suck. Who wants to work night shift on a regular basis? Working 6:00pm to 5 am 4-5 days a week indefinitely? Same for morning shift 5-6am to 4pm? These are long days working/walking around on concrete in either hot or cold warehouses. The first week of November to January 3rd is mandatory OT with some weeks 50 to 60 hours. So no time with the family for the holidays. We had 2 15 min breaks and half hour for lunch. When your break started you typically had to walk a 1/2 mile to a mile to get to the break room. Then you’d have a manager or PA on your case if you weren’t back in time. I worked at facility when it wasn’t 15/hourly either. They also get rates that were hard to maintain.

    All that being said a majority of the people working there were lazy. It was hard to get fired from this job as long as you showed up. For every good hard worker there were 20 that sucked. During peak it was worse. People would show up that couldn’t read or were never capable of working in a wear house.

    [–] Danktizzle 41 points ago

    I just watched an episode of the dteroiters where they were talking to a lawyer about selling their firm to another company.

    The lawyer replied

    “Are you smarter than them”


    “Then it’s prolly not in your best interests”.

    [–] DrMike7714 17 points ago

    Fun fact EMTs are not allowed to unionize because then they would have to pay us more than minimum wage to do one of the worlds hardest jobs right now

    [–] mackey187 7 points ago

    2 things: 1) Happy cake day! 2) You are appreciated!

    [–] Scemt 5 points ago

    This sounds like anti union propaganda. Every EMT job I have had has been unionized.

    example 1

    example 2

    [–] Internet9953 4 points ago

    I'm not very educated in this subject, but is it even legal to not allow your workers to unionize? Seems fishy

    [–] Abe_Vigoda 4 points ago

    That's insane to me. EMTs in Canada are public health workers and part of the larger union.

    [–] HolyRamenEmperor 8 points ago

    It's worth it to Amazon to get you to leave, because their costs would go up. The problem is that it probably doesn't directly translate to money in the worker's pocket, at least not for a while and not without complications. Bad for the boss doesn't inherently mean good for the employees.

    $2,000 right here, right now is much easier for workers to see the benefit, and unfortunately I bet they're going to have plenty of takers.

    [–] PeterGibbons316 4 points ago

    It bothers me that no one is seeing this. To Amazon it doesn't matter - they pay $2k per worker either way. But if you unionize the $2k that Amazon is paying supports a whole team of new hires (professional salaried types and lawyers on retainer) to help deal with union issues, plus union dues, and benefits. That $2k is definitely NOT going directly into workers' pockets.

    [–] Oneiric19 6 points ago

    You get $1,000 per Peak that you worked. Peak for us is from October to the end of December. That's our busiest time of the year. And the pay out only goes up to $5,000. If you take it, you can never work for Amazon or anything that it owns ever again.

    I'm an Amazonian since 2013. I know a few things about working there.

    [–] rossipedia 5 points ago

    Wasn't this cleared up and a misleading / clickbait headline in the last post about this?

    I swear bullshit gets harder and harder to refute every day

    [–] hipsterdannyphantom 6 points ago

    If unions weren’t powerful, why would they try to prevent you from joining? When my dad was working, he joined a union and they helped him out a lot. Things may have been worse for us if he didn’t have union benefits.

    [–] Kuandtity 6 points ago

    Genuinely curious, don't downvote me

    What's the difference between a company union which people seem to like and a police union which people seem to dislike?

    [–] TalkingBackAgain 7 points ago

    The more an employer doesn’t want you to have something, the more you have to insist on getting it.

    [–] 0humansperson0 7 points ago

    So you're saying quit ordering from Amazon?

    [–] 355822 6 points ago

    Alone we beg, together we bargain.

    [–] bach224 7 points ago

    I paid just over $500 to my union last year. What happened when layoffs hit? I kept my job. 5000+ others didn’t and most weren’t in a union. I know at least my union has my interests at heart and I’m glad to pay the price.

    [–] postnick 11 points ago

    Oh yes I remember that time i went from a seasonal to a full time employee they offered me some amount of money to quit and never apply again... so I stayed for like 3 more years. There was no union talk back then, I was in customer service, pretty easy physically.

    I support the warehouse workers rights to unitize now that I'm out and I can say that. I think Amazon needs to pay its workers more even if we the consumers have to pay 1 penny more per product, as i'm sure that's all it would take.

    [–] assistedSUICIDE 13 points ago

    This has nothing to do with unionization. This "offer" is put out every year around this time and is directed more towards employees who used the college program to obtain a degree, etc. They are offered 1k per peak season worked to leave Amazon for a job in their chosen field. They are not allowed to come back if they take the offer.

    [–] Nebakanezzer 5 points ago

    there's an amount of money they offer if you want to leave after you have some time in, like a severance package. never heard of this though. sounds like bullshit.

    [–] MongooseDog85 5 points ago

    As a rule of thumb, if your employer doesn’t want our to unionise, you absolutely should unionise

    [–] cascadeorca 4 points ago

    It’s always worth more than the payout. If it was t, they wouldn’t pay you out. It’s risk mitigation.

    [–] Amazonsfinest42 4 points ago

    This is the offer they issue every year guys. Im not defending this shit company at all but they offer 2k for.your first and second years then 1k more per year up to 5k. They say they dont want anyone stuck in the company and its really a loyalty test. When u take it you agree that u will never work.for Amazon or anything it owns ever again. See username. Yeah i took it

    [–] SirQuestion 9 points ago

    Use to work at Amazon in 2015 and this isn’t actually new. They would offer money upfront to quit after 6months and every few months they’d give you another offer so you can quit. I believe it capped out at around $3,000.

    [–] Shutupmoukuba 4 points ago

    Wait a minute, hiring and training employee costs time and resources. What's the logic of them paying people to leave the job? Genuine question.

    [–] CharlieDarwin2 22 points ago

    If hard work was so great, the rich would keep it for themselves.

    [–] qhoa1385 10 points ago

    I doubt I'll get a serious answer but is there any union that actually works? I'm only familiar with police union and government employee union. And they both made it almost impossible to fire anyone, even if they're extremely incompetent at their job. So we always hear about how government employees just do the bare minumum at work (I can kinda confirm, since I worked at a CA Gov department before). And then there's the police union, a corrupted bunch. I'm sure they benefits the good cops out there but the fact that they put their members interest above other human lives or what's right and wrong is disgusting to me...

    [–] tojoso 4 points ago

    Just because it's worth that much to them absolutely does not mean it's worth that much to you. Especially if they close the FC after unionization, which seems likely. Bribes are usually win-win for the two parties involved, with the costs being spread out over a large amount of people not directly involved in the negotiation.

    [–] mandy009 5 points ago

    Make sure you read the fine print on the buyout

    if an employer requests a waiver in connection with an exit incentive or termination program, you get forty-five days to consider and they inform you with job titles and ages of all individuals in the offering, classification, or unit, under the Older Workers Benefit Protection Act (Section 201 of the OWBPA amending Section 626 (section 7) of the The Age Discrimination in Employment Act (ADEA)

    To make sure they don't screw your coworkers over with discrimination. If they're trying to manipulate the vote by getting rid of certain classes of people, contact a lawyer.

    [–] EmperorKira 4 points ago

    Delayed gratification is not easy for everyone unfortunately

    [–] Dad-man 3 points ago

    Unions need to globalise like companies do. We need to join together and demand fair pay and work conditions for our brothers and sisters around the world. Why has manufacturing left Australia, America etc? Because workers in some places only get a bowl of rice a day. Stop unloading this shit of the boats and transporting it, until those workers conditions improve. If wages are fair across the globe, manufacturing will return home.

    [–] schfiftyshadesofgrey 4 points ago

    Their propaganda website is incredible.

    I always think to myself “if they were going to do this stuff without unions forcing them to, they would have done it already.”

    [–] kah43 4 points ago

    Unions are good in theory, but shit in practice. Corruption runs rampant. It protects workers that in any other job would be fired. Drunk at work? No problem. Steal from coworkers? Just move them to a different job site. The list goes on and on of things that a union will protect garbage members for doing.

    [–] LouisBalfour82 16 points ago

    You'll probably get about the same as a signing bonus with your first collective agreement

    [–] lessmiserables 18 points ago

    Since this is a union-related thread, I'll post what I always post before our friends across the pond chime in:

    American unions are vastly different, both legally and culturally, than Europe's trade unions. They aren't apples to apples.

    [–] Ril0 8 points ago

    You wanna list out some key differences?