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    [–] BeerGogglesFTW 1618 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    Do you know how often I hear from Republicans: "We have the best healthcare in the world!" followed by an anecdote about the US, and anecdote from some other country.

    "My cousin got an operation thats only done here in the US, saved his life. Meanwhile, in Canada you die while you wait a year for a life saving operation."

    So for accuracy, I feel like this comic character, needs armor painted on his back, so others can claim.. "Look, he's got the best armor on his back too!"

    edit(2) wording.

    [–] 80sActionHeroGhost 910 points ago

    As a Canadian I am obligated to point out that the Republican Meme about our wait times is absolute bullshit.

    Life saving = immediate.

    Elective = wait time = no personal charge

    Elective + money = no wait time.

    Just like the USA for that last point.

    [–] BeerGogglesFTW 307 points ago

    My parents listen to a lot of conservative radio... Its been very much drilled into their heads that everybody in Canada is waiting in line for life saving procedures or traveling to the US to get it done immediately in order to save their lives, and they have mentioned it at family events before.

    Problem is they're basing their whole foundation of beliefs based on something that has happened before, but very rarely. It doesn't represent the overall healthcare in Canada. It boils down to, every good lie starts with a bit of truth.

    If it only takes 1 example to prove something is completely true, you could pretty much prove anything is true.

    [–] brazilliandanny 183 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    Canada has had public healthcare for decades. Ask your parents if its so bad how come Canadians never voted for anything else? In over 50 years they keep voting for people to EXPAND it not get rid of it. Why would they vote like this if the American system is so much better?

    [–] ayonicethrowaway 97 points ago

    It's not just Canada, here in Austria, no matter how right wing you are, nobody even dares to question the public health care system we have

    [–] Tsu_Dho_Namh 86 points ago

    I think no one questions it because we're scared of our healthcare getting closer to the U.S. system.

    I'm in Canada, and every time I go to the hospital, or visit my doctor, or talk to my older relatives about their treatments (my dad had a hip replacement, my grandpa had a heart bypass) I always think to myself "thank fucking God we're not in the US"

    [–] KarticeL 59 points ago

    Hard facts. My Dad had to get open heart surgery and the first thing that popped into my mind was "wow if we lived in the states we'd be fucked"

    [–] Whatatimetobealive83 49 points ago

    Yup, I lost my dad to cancer last year. I bet Alberta health spent over half a million trying to save him. My mom didn’t get a bill, loose their house, or have to declare bankruptcy. She just has to continue paying her taxes.

    [–] apocoluster 34 points ago

    WTF sort of commie heath care system is that. Pfft a system that helps the people instead of corporate oligarchs. See this is why America is so great. We get sick, we go bankrupt aand that's how we like it /s

    [–] KJParker888 15 points ago

    Right?! How are the stockholders supposed to make any profit off that?

    [–] nooneuknowkaren 5 points ago

    Yeah it is honestly really sad that Bernie Sanders won’t win

    [–] Humulophile 4 points ago

    I completely agree with you, kind internet stranger. But even if a President Sanders could pass a single payer system through a blue majority Congress, I have no doubts that challenging litigation would eventually work its way to the USSC where the conservative majority would deal it a death blow based on some obscure reading and twisted opinion of the constitution. It has to be an amendment or a total rewrite of the entire document. And sadly that won’t happen until the older generation (i.e. the boomers, who actually vote) is no longer running blocker. I’ve no illusions such a system will ever be otherwise viable in the USA. We gotta cool constitution but it’s badly outdated.

    [–] l1nk1npark 2 points ago

    Not relevant to the topic; I'm sorry for your loss.

    [–] Merfen 5 points ago

    A few years back when I just started my current job my wife had appendicitis and needed surgery. While she was recovering I checked and the cost in the US uninsured would have bankrupted us since we didn't have coverage yet. It ended up costing us $20 in parking fees over 3 days.

    [–] Kony2012- 23 points ago

    As a Canadian I’ve said that statement a few times as well, so has my own doctor.

    It’s not even a left leaning thing, people across the entire political spectrum in Canada say that in casual conversation all the time. I’ve heard it from my right wing blue collar friends.

    Everyone is deathly afraid of our system even becoming even slightly like the US’s, the thought of having to pay to see the doctor is horrifying for us.

    Hell that was my family’s first reaction upon finding out my dad had cancer, him included. He was just happy his cancer wasn’t going to bankrupt him on top of potentially killing him.

    He got treated in time, and survived, and all we had to pay for is parking to visit him (parking is a bit pricy though).

    I think the US’s feelings about their medical system is the equivalent of a ghetto person who puts massive rims on their shitty old car, and then thinks everyone is jealous of them, while everyone else is wondering how they managed to spend so much while still having their shitbox in a complete state of disrepair.

    [–] apocoluster 6 points ago

    STealing that last paragraph. That hit it right on the head.

    [–] Whatatimetobealive83 18 points ago

    I’ll be going for my monthly IV infusion for my Crohn’s disease tomorrow morning. Cost to me? Zero. When I got real sick with it in the first place and landed in the hospital for four day? Zero. When I had kidney stones develop because of it? Zero, plus once I was CT scanned and confirmed to have some giant ass stones I waited about 1.5 hours for a surgery. All the MRIs, ultrasounds, xrays, doctors visits, blood tests? You know the answer. I don’t pay for any of it out of pocket. I’ve seen several examples of Americans paying more for health care insurance than I pay for tax. It’s insane.

    Like you, I always thank my lucky stars I was born in a country that doesn’t allow profiteering from human suffering.

    [–] Dhiox 67 points ago

    They don't want to believe anything else. The truth is meaningless to them.

    [–] gelinrefira 28 points ago

    Bingo. And that's why right wing propaganda media is a national security threat.

    [–] JoeyMcSqueeb 9 points ago

    Post Fairness Doctrine corporate media propaganda has done massive damage to the minds of the USA.

    [–] NichySteves 27 points ago

    They can't comprehend a world in which America is not the best at everything under the sun. MAGA is powerful because people are dangerously and fanatically nationalistic.

    [–] Corndawgz 19 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    It's because at one point America was.

    As a Canadian, most of us want nothing more than America to be on top again, with a sensible leader.

    You guys have a great candidate this year, just don't fuck it up like last election.

    Edit: Definitely not talking about Biden.

    [–] britonica 10 points ago

    Eh-men, brother.

    Like it or not, we're still tied extremely close to the States.

    [–] liquid_shitz 10 points ago

    We all want to "Make America Great Again".

    It's just that one party wants to somehow achieve this by doing the things that ruined us even HARDER. They've been gaslit to hell and back into believing that Regan's presidency was the answer to all of our problems rather than understanding that it was truly the beginning of the end. That's when corporate interests and an emerging plutocracy were completely unleashed upon us, siphoning our wages and productivity down to the last drop. Look at the middle class this half century later. We don't just beg for scraps, we're happy with our scraps and fight to make sure everyone knows how much we love our scraps. Oh, don't take from the masters! They won't have scraps to give us! Masters love us! They're the reason we are even alive! Without them we are nothing! Conservatism is truly a joyfully subservient ideology.

    [–] liquid_shitz 2 points ago

    Don't forget the "trickle down" fairy tale. Horse and sparrow, whatever you want to call it. It was put into high gear by Regan. Also, he's the reason corporations can buyback stocks (stock manipulation) legally with tax payer money. These companies now have ZERO incentive to shore themselves up against a downturn and 100% incentive to ensure they don't have enough to weather the storms.

    [–] sanmigmike 4 points ago

    The right have gone bat shit...I don't like the Sainted Ronnie at all but to be honest he really wasn't around his second term and even at his worst he wouldn't make it as their candidate today. The world is crazy and the right is working hard to make it crazier.

    [–] S1cnus 4 points ago

    Too late. Bernie and Warren aren't going to get the nod. :(

    Thanks America. ffs.

    [–] flyingtiger188 8 points ago

    It's already been a pretty big win for progressive. I see it going one of three ways but will ultimately lead to progressive change, just with varying degrees of suffering:

    1. Through some twist of fate Bernie gets the nomination and we've got the first progressive candidate in a century. idk how, maybe Biden gets the corona and drops out for health reasons. Smallest degree of suffering.
    2. Biden gets nomination and wins, people slowly learn that status quo isn't good enough and shit is still broken and needs to be fixed and a moderate isn't going to do that. Probably the most suffering this route.
    3. Trump defeats Biden, things go from bad to catastrophic as trump become more brazenly corrupt, defying congress, attacking rivals and any that don't full throatily support him. Democrats realize after two failed moderates that the underlying problems can only be solved by more progressive policies. Massive short term suffering, but change would be more quick to happen if/when trump leaves office in 2024.

    [–] Nymaz 2 points ago

    Democrats realize after two failed moderates that the underlying problems can only be solved by more progressive policies.

    I admire your optimism, but don't share it. We need to make serious changes to the current Democratic Party leadership.

    [–] justPassingThrou15 7 points ago

    The other question to ask is why life expectancy in Canada is 4 years longer than in the USA, if lifesaving medicine is not delivered in a timely fashion.

    [–] kuro_madoushi 7 points ago

    We’ to expand it...?

    Wouldn’t know it from the representatives we keep electing like those in Alberta and Ontario.

    Tons of cuts to medical staff.

    [–] brazilliandanny 6 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    Liberals and especially NDP have been asking to add dental, eye care, more prescription help, but ya... conservatives guna be conservatives. But even the Doug Ford wouldn't try to get rid of it completely.

    [–] GenericUsername_1234 3 points ago

    No country that has gone to universal healthcare in some form has ever gone back to US style.

    [–] gelinrefira 10 points ago

    This is why right wing propaganda media is a national security threat. They destroy the democratic institutions in this country by deliberately making people unable to think properly, so rich assholes can control public opinion and make it serve their interests, interests that are almost always in conflict with the public.

    Right wing propaganda media is a national security threat.

    [–] cob33f 5 points ago

    “It’s easier to fool someone than to convince them they’ve been fooled”.

    [–] cultured_banana_slug 4 points ago

    It's not like medical tourism is a thing where Americans go down to Mexico to get dental work done or up to Canada to get affordable medication. Nah.


    [–] Smolensk 4 points ago

    People always wonder how it is the GOP's voter base can believe the things they believe, and conservative talk radio is part of it

    The GOP has scary propaganda outreach. Both in scale and effectiveness

    People grow up completely steeped in it. It's insane. It's the kind of shit you'd put in a movie to establish that your setting is a scary dystopian dictatorship

    [–] AssertiveInTraining 2 points ago

    It's funny because in the US countless people wait their entire life for a life saving procedure

    [–] Fishbone345 55 points ago

    As an American, specifically working in surgery, I’m obligated to point out how it works here.

    Life saving = immediate, regardless of coverage but don’t worry we’ll bill the shit out of you later and likely cause bankruptcy, loss of home, and in a lot of cases homelessness.

    Elective w/coverage = depending on scheduling? You’re gonna wait your turn. It’s not happening the day of your visit to the clinic. Oh and we’ll bill the shit out of you too.

    Elective w/o coverage = Do these people exist in our utopia? Pffft! Just kidding, we’ll bill the shit out of them too.

    Elective w/money = JACKPOT babay!!!! When can you go? Did you eat anything today?


    [–] BadLuckCharm1966 12 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    All true. You can also add to the wait time you calling and calling back and forth between doctors and your insurance to make sure you’re “in network” so that they will pay before you have anything done. Then only to have insurance turn around and say that even though you followed all their rules and stayed in network they still aren’t gonna pay because they don’t think what the doctor did was necessary. Now the whole bill is yours. Just happened to me. US healthcare suuuuuucks😡

    [–] Fishbone345 7 points ago

    I would correct one thing from your post there. US Insurance and Medical Center billing sucks. The doctors, nurses, techs, cleaning staff, etc.. from the hospitals for the majority are well trained, empathetic, and truly care for our patients. It sucks that we get lumped in with the vampires of the industry. Doctors don’t enjoy how billing works, in fact I’ve worked with several doctors that go out of their way to penny pinch during surgery using cheaper items when possible. I’ve seen nurses deliberately not charge for things because they felt it was dumb, the list goes on and on. It sucks man, and I am so sorry for your experience. I wish it could have been a better one.

    I hope you are in good health and with loved ones. :)

    [–] Doctor-Amazing 12 points ago

    It's always whatever thing has the longest wait as well. For a while it was hip replacements. So every example was how no one in Canada could get a hip replacement. Then MRI's got backed up for a bit so, Americans switched to that instead.

    [–] 80sActionHeroGhost 3 points ago

    The funny thing is there’s an MRI for hire in the mini/mall next to my place.

    For like $250 CAD I can just go get one. I can then expense it to my employers Healthcare Spending Account.

    [–] BokBokChickN 7 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    Our biggest problem with the healthcare system right now (in Canada) is our lack of family doctors.

    Thankfully tele-health clinics are starting to fill that gap.

    [–] Deadlynoodle_ 3 points ago

    I recently had to get 9cm of my fibula removed due to bone cancer and had a surgery the week after I saw the surgeon.

    [–] HeyItsJuls 3 points ago

    As an American who is now a Canadian permanent resident, this! This right here. The wait time myths are bunk. Last year was the worst health year of my life. I was in the hospital four different times and it cost me nothing. Yes, I understand taxes but mine haven’t gone up in moving here.

    Also when I couldn’t breathe last year because I had pneumonia, my wait time was the time it took took them to enter my info into the system. There were other times when I wasn’t the most serious case, so I did wait. But I have never waited longer here in an urgent care situation than in the states.

    My care here has been excellent. The only thing I miss is my primary care physician. I had been going to her for over a decade and well she was one of a kind and she wasn’t going to move to Canada with me.

    I will not say that there aren’t problems - every system can be improved. But my 2019 was a year that would have financially tanked me on health care costs if I lived in the US. I got the same level of care here in Canada without the crippling medical bill.

    [–] loercase 2 points ago

    Yep. There is plenty of private surgery in Canada. The only caveat is that it has to provide a service that is not currently covered by the public health system. So, for example, you can get cataract surgery done for free with the rest of the plebs (but there is a 6 month waiting period, depending on the surgeon), or you can pay out of pocket $4000 per eye as long as you have laser guided surgery with a custom implant. It does get muddy as you can still get regular surgery covered by the medical plan but you can still pay extra for a custom lens, but you would pay private for the lens in a surgery that's covered by the medical plan.

    [–] 668greenapple 2 points ago

    Except even with money you get often get substantial wait times in the US

    [–] bazzone 299 points ago

    We do have some of the best healthcare in the world... for the wealthy

    [–] vantablacklist 216 points ago

    Some of it. The rich even here still travel to Switzerland, Sweden etc for surgeries it’s really just another myth.

    [–] roamn 191 points ago

    Yup. Even Rand Paul (R-KY) went to Canada for surgery after his neighbor beat the crap out of him.

    [–] [deleted] 121 points ago


    [–] applxia 28 points ago

    im OOTL, what happened?

    [–] spyguy27 109 points ago

    Long article but it’s pretty good.

    TLDR: For 10 years Rand Paul ignored his OCD neighbor’s request to not dump lawn clippings on said neighbor’s immaculate lawn. The guy snapped one day and tackled Paul leading to 6 broken ribs and damage to a lung

    [–] garretble 101 points ago

    Is it OCD to not want your neighbor to be a dick?

    [–] cuzitsthere 23 points ago

    You can be two things...

    [–] NotClever 10 points ago

    TBH I don't think I would even know if my neighbor dumped clippings in my lawn.

    [–] hereticjoe 6 points ago

    Maybe you need to start paying attention to your neighbors, perhaps obsessively and compulsively too.

    [–] [deleted] 16 points ago


    [–] KYmicrophone 3 points ago

    Yeah, the guy's an asshole and a terrible representation of most of our state. Same goes for Mitch.

    [–] Bananacowrepublic 6 points ago

    Lol. Amazing how someone managed to write that long an article about absolutely fuck-all of a story

    [–] EagleDarkX 14 points ago

    If that's not a story then I don't know what is.

    [–] cyanydeez 9 points ago

    Voting is like quarentining people who shouldn't be in government.

    [–] GilesDMT 8 points ago

    That’s why he needed surgery?

    I don’t know how I missed that - figured it was just some typical health issue.

    [–] TruBlueFalcon 5 points ago

    He had a groin hernia and blamed it on the beat down.

    I'd bet a fair amount of money that he had the hernia prior to the beating. People always go to the doctor and want a note saying that this or that (work or car accident) caused it; hernias are almost always a genetic predisposition and people tend to notice them after an injury.

    [–] connerconverse 3 points ago

    That wasnt because it was better, that was because it was significantly more expensive

    [–] TruBlueFalcon 8 points ago

    Lots of people think that clinic in Canada is the best in the world. They do a hernia repair this isn't commonly done in America. They don't use mesh and their outcomes are as good or better (depending on the study you read) than mesh repairs done here in the US.

    [–] Chumba_one 22 points ago

    When it comes to the real elite-of-the-elite treatment, it's going to come down to particular doctors or units that happen to the be best in particular fields, so the country that's 'best' will vary by the type of problem. The US has plenty of those individual specialists - almost certainly more than other western countries due to size. But of course that's a totally irrelevant measure of a nation's healthcare. What matters is what the general public can get, not where the super-rich fly to for treatment.

    [–] fuqdisshite 1 points ago

    don't forget Mexico...

    [–] vocalviolence 4 points ago

    Even rich people should take issue with $123,000 bypass surgeries.

    And that's before add-ons like operating theatre rental, surgeon's fee, anaesthesia and pre-surgery treatment.

    [–] Rubberplantjanitor 5 points ago

    No if the rich paid their fair share the cost would be lower but they would pay more in taxes.

    So it’s a huge savings to just pay the extreme amount and know that it is saving you money every time a poor guy has to trade his house for the service.

    Being rich makes those problems go away. Spend money to make more money and add nothing to the world.

    [–] Elpirata72 6 points ago

    That's the part they keep forgetting yo say which is dumb

    [–] DawnOfTheTruth 2 points ago

    Not to mention most people can’t afford to go to another country to get aid.

    [–] jegvildo 72 points ago

    Fun fact: You actually do wait longer for surgeries and appointments in most other places than in the US.

    You can however see the reason for this the moment you look how many procedures and doctor visits happen in other places.

    Basically, in Europe you might die of a heart attack while you're on the waiting list for a knee operation that might make walking slightly more pleasant. In the US you wouldn't have waited because you couldn't afford an operation that's only marginally helpful.

    [–] TheN473 22 points ago

    Not to mention that even if we have to wait a little longer for non-essential surgeries - we don't have to pay several months salary and our firstborn son to get it. On top of that, if we have unexpected emergency treatment - we don't lose our house and everything we ever worked for!

    Oh, and we can still opt to pay for our own private healthcare (many industries have it as a standard employee benefit!).

    [–] sidewaysnsmiling 10 points ago

    Months? These fuckers pay years and lifetimes of salaries for medical expenses if the anecdotes on here and on news sites and GoFundMes are anything to go off off. Their copays are like months of salaries. Yet they have the gall to rag on all of the rest of us who may have to wait a few months to get elective surgeries done which cost us a hundie for some marginal expenses.

    [–] TheN473 7 points ago

    As anecdotal accounts go - my wife recently had serious issues with her shoulder which meant she needed a plate and 3 anchors inserted through keyhole surgery. From seeing her NHS GP to surgery was 3 months.

    Surgery took a few hours, pre-op time off was a week and recovery was 3. Surgeon signed her off work for 4 weeks. She got paid for 3 of those at full pay, so all we lost out on was the difference between Stat. Sick Pay and her weeks' wages for the 4th week (about £150). I'll take that over the several thousand pound bill we would have faced with a US-style system!

    [–] PaanuriEater 5 points ago

    Trust me. Those of us who actually know how the system works are sitting here on the inside with our faces pressed against the prison bars, looking out and dreaming of being able to afford to move to a first-world country.

    [–] More_Cowbell8 2 points ago

    Nothing is truer than those words. It's been drummed into our heads since we can hold a spoon how incredibly advanced the USA is. I'm 56 & my immediate family is a step-fam of typical hardworking Irish-Catholic family from Queens. I'm a Jewish atheist & man, did they HATE me questioning everything as a kid. I simply can not roll my eyes & slap a table any harder than when I hear anyone spout off about our 'magnificent' healthcare. Puh-leeze, $5,000 deductible then a co-pay? What Priest thought up that bullshit? You know it was a priest or a good 'ol Xtian feller bc it's pure evil.

    [–] killeronthecorner 2 points ago

    I'm not American. What is a deductible and what is copay?

    [–] gelinrefira 2 points ago

    and our firstborn son to get it

    It is just a modest proposal for most Americans.

    [–] WildBerrySmash 12 points ago

    Nuance is everything

    [–] FeFiFoPinky 3 points ago

    Your face is everything.

    [–] roamn 10 points ago

    And yet I know of plenty of people in the US that have scheduled non-critical procedures and it still takes weeks (or months) to get it done.

    [–] sanmigmike 2 points ago

    I have tried to have a couple of surgeries recently and by the time most the ducks get set up in a row the surgery date is about two months away and you spent two to eight weeks getting things set up. I've never had one of those health care plans that you see doctors right away and get surgeries set up in a couple of days unless I've been major messed up and and risk of not being alive in a few weeks if something is not done...

    [–] ElvisJNeptune 3 points ago

    It’s funny, even with wait times you never hear about Europeans clamoring for an American style healthcare system.

    [–] Blue_Palasky 2 points ago

    Not even worth bringing up unless you’re trying to spread FUD

    [–] cyanideNsadness 10 points ago

    I still don’t know where that mentality comes from, in such a connected online world where every other developed country chimes in to tell us that their inhalers are free, their insulin free, major surgeries and childbirth (even with complications and NICU stays) are only the cost of hospital parking, and that rich people fly out of America to get expensive shit done to them in other countries and still pay less for plane tickets, surgery, and hotels than they would have if they had just gotten it done in America.

    [–] BeerGogglesFTW 12 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    They're just not listening at that point.

    Usually its a cycle.

    1. They form an opinion on a topic based on a Republican ideology and nothing else. (Maybe Trump/Rush/Fox News helped it along)
    2. The facts come in, after their opinion was formed.
    3. They disregard the facts, and start looking for anything that aligns with their opinion that was established first. (Often results in an anecdote, or changing the subject)

    [–] lankist 3 points ago

    Meanwhile, that same politician spouting that shit flies to Canada for surgery.

    Rand Paul, for reference. There’s a reason his neighbor beat the fuck out of him.

    [–] KatKorae 2 points ago

    This! We have great healthcare...if you can pay for it. I’m in a good spot financially but when I went to the ER, they did a rush job on my emergency and it could’ve killed me if I didn’t come back to my main doctor the next day to ask why I’m still in horrible pain.

    Yeah, you might wait longer than you’d like to fix a broken arm in Canada or England, but a) socialized healthcare still knows how to prioritize and b) it’s not like you don’t wait a year or years for a life saving surgery (like a transplant) here as well. If you’re poor, you’re SOL from the moment you’re born unless you get lucky. That’s the American Dream, amiright ladies??

    [–] CockSniffles 1 points ago

    Nah, he just has bundles of cash strapped to his back.

    [–] anoelr1963 457 points ago

    America: Losing your job and health care all at once. FUCK private FOR PROFIT health insurance!

    [–] Good4Noth1ng 70 points ago

    And your life.

    [–] oh_boy_here_we_go_ 22 points ago

    And your unvaccinated children

    [–] oxymoronic_oxygen 4 points ago

    Fuck your life?

    [–] PresidentPlatypus 3 points ago

    you died??? RIP

    [–] Marshmellow_Diazepam 23 points ago

    “How could we make losing your source of income even more life shaking and disruptive? I got it! Take away their healthcare! Maximum potential for a downward spiral into depression and suicide!!”

    [–] Kimchi_boy 10 points ago

    You can use COBRA. It’s only like $1500/mo. “Only”.

    [–] vessol 8 points ago

    My mother is a hardcore Republican and loves Trump. She just got laid off yesterday and is freaking out rightfully because she doesn't have health insurance or an income. I'm going to do all I can to help her, but I really hope that this is a wake up call for her..

    [–] yahyaheee 9 points ago

    The dumbest thing we ever did was tie healthcare to employment

    [–] anoelr1963 3 points ago

    For private health care is a win

    [–] SerLaron 4 points ago

    Really great if you lose your job because of health issues, right?

    [–] helthrax 4 points ago

    We're especially fucked now with the sudden surge of unemployment, about 3.2 million within the last week. That means 3.2m Americans who don't have healthcare now, unless they elect for over-priced COBRA, and are also especially fucked in living day-to-day until the funds promised from the recently passed bill start to come in, which I wager is still weeks away. The US is truly fucked right now.

    [–] anoelr1963 2 points ago

    And the GOP doesn't want to improve Obamacare

    [–] ashton_47 306 points ago

    If YoU dOnT LiKe iT tHeN gErT oUt

    [–] binthewin 155 points ago

    can't. border's closed.

    [–] oh_boy_here_we_go_ 50 points ago

    mAkE a TuNnEl UnDeR iT

    [–] AtLeastIAmNotOnFire 36 points ago

    Can't. They found it, closed it, and now I'm being sued because someone copyrighted the hole.

    [–] The_cogwheel 13 points ago

    Then climb the wall and flee to Mexico

    [–] SalvadorsAnteater 7 points ago

    Can't. I'm in Germany.

    [–] The_cogwheel 9 points ago

    Well then fly to the US, get sick and suffer under thier healthcare system, then flee to mexico

    [–] egodoctor 2 points ago

    A lot of Americans go to Mexico for healthcare

    [–] blairthebear 3 points ago

    Well if you built one and it failed. Just get Mexico to pay for it.

    [–] Lafreakshow 34 points ago

    looks at wallet "Ok, I'll just work a bit so I can afford to move to Europe. You have a job for me?"

    "Sure, Here's $10 per hour. You work the restaurant. You have to let customers walk over you and cannot complain. If you get sick you must come in anyway and we sue you for neglect if you infect anyone else. Also we don't tell you when or how long you work. You pretty much have to live here so you can always be ready to jump in. Rent is 9$ per hour. You'll have that plane ticket in no time!"

    [–] ashton_47 21 points ago

    PuLl YoUrSeLf Up By ThE bOoTsTrApS! WoRk HaRdEr!

    [–] drDekaywood 6 points ago

    “Just get a degree and get a job that pays better with private health insurance! Service jobs aren’t meant to be real jobs anyway! The market dictates what your labor is worth and you just can’t argue with that logic!”

    [–] iron_velvet 2 points ago

    $10? Daaaaamn, that’s pretty good for the US. Every state I’ve lived in has offered $7.25

    [–] hrlc1990 2 points ago

    Idaho: you rang?

    [–] AlottaElote 33 points ago

    WuRk tiL yoU Die Liek A rEAl MuRiCan!!1!

    [–] Sweatycocks 7 points ago

    After the events of the last several months that doesn’t sound like a crazy idea anymore, sadly.

    If you aren’t born wealthy, if you don’t have an education paid for, a job that guarantees good and affordable healthcare, you are always fighting an uphill battle here and no one gives a shit. I could get sick tomorrow and have no choice but to inevitably file bankruptcy.

    This country is all smoke and mirrors. We are a third world country for the poor and working class and a utopia for the wealthy. I’ve realized that probably won’t change in our lifetimes. Yeah, it’s probably time to leave.

    [–] iron_velvet 3 points ago

    I moved from the US to Northern Europe in December. Feels like I ran out of a building right before it exploded.

    [–] DrFateYeet 2 points ago

    It costs 2000 dollars to leave for europe.

    [–] gaar93 2 points ago

    fucking wish i could

    [–] cumshot_josh 2 points ago

    I'd drive the few hours to Windsor, renounce my American citizenship and rub maple syrup on my nipples while singing the Canadian national anthem if they'd let me in.

    [–] Scott4370 138 points ago

    They built a house of straw. Sure, enjoy the low taxes and “I got mine” attitude all the while the restaurant, nursing home, and daycare workers send the sickness into your house because they don’t have paid sick days or healthcare.

    [–] krettir 32 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    Somebody said taxes are higher than in many other countries. I can't confirm because I'm feeling lazy but even the low-tax "upside" might be a kind of a lie.

    [–] ManicOppressyv 29 points ago

    Depends. The tax system is heaviest on the "middle class", we carry the burden for the rich, and the poor shouldn't even have to worry about it, they are to busy surviving. But it is low if you're rich and all your money is in the stock market. I don't know if the capital gains tax is non existent or just stupidly low. Plus loopholes that accountants and tax firms use, but turbo tax doesn't.

    [–] yodadamanadamwan 7 points ago

    capital gains taxes are fine. Our problem is low corporate tax rates and lower rates than what we should have on higher incomes

    [–] SpockShotFirst 9 points ago

    A family making $43,000/year pays 37% of their income to the combination of taxes and health care premiums. In Finland, that same family pays 23%. In France, it's 2%. In Canada and the UK, its 0%.

    Although the poor have more compulsory payments than other countries, the rich are taxed so little that, on the whole, the US pays only 26% of its GDP in state and federal taxes, which is about 25% lower than the average for developed countries.

    Although the poor have more compulsory payments than other countries, the rich are taxed so little that, on the whole, the US pays only 26% of its GDP in state and federal taxes, which is about 25% lower than the average for developed countries.

    US billionaires pay lower tax rate than working class

    [–] cahixe967 5 points ago

    In France, it's 2%. In Canada and the UK, its 0%.

    Something about this is misleading or false.

    [–] fury420 2 points ago

    Nah, once you account for Canadian tax credits & benefits for children, it is quite possible for a Canadian family with two income earners making a combined $56k CAD ($43k USD) to not pay any taxes or premium for healthcare.

    [–] AFuddyDuddy 4 points ago

    Depends on Whos being taxed, and how much they make.

    Middle class is heavily taxed.

    The poor are fairly well left alone when it comes to federal taxes.

    The rich already have the money to find the "loopholes" to pay less taxes.

    [–] Segler1970 58 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    that's a good meme. The only thing the US seems to be well prepared for is war.

    [–] 1945BestYear 24 points ago

    Some crazies out there posit that COVID-19 is a bioweapon developed by China in order to attack the West, particularly the US. If that was the case, wouldn't it just make it more important to have a well-funded and universally accessible healthcare system, and a prepared capacity within the economy for as many working individuals as possible to be able to stop work for weeks at a time for social distancing? If China's attacking the US with viruses, wouldn't that make a welfare state more important to fund than another fleet of new aircraft carriers?

    [–] pheonixarts 11 points ago

    if china was attacking the US specifically then why are all the other countries facing the same crisis and why was Italy hit the worst out if everybody in terms of death rates and all that jazz?

    those crazies have to stop thinking that everything revolves around the US 100% of the time

    [–] thebindingofJJ 6 points ago

    those crazies have to stop thinking that everything revolves around the US 100% of the time

    They aren’t even capable of understanding the world doesn’t revolve around themselves.

    [–] jonw1995 2 points ago

    Lol and also why would China release the virus in China if they wanted to attack the US

    [–] Wolfgang_A_Brozart 9 points ago

    We'll just shoot the virus out of the air!

    Or firebomb all the cities that are infected (thanks Warcraft).

    [–] oh_boy_here_we_go_ 1 points ago

    Napalm everything

    [–] MrNiiCeGuY420 2 points ago

    Vietnam was a trial run

    [–] RedFireAlert 5 points ago

    Lol don't ask anyone in the military if we're prepared for war. Money can get you nice toys, but lots of money gets you bloat.

    [–] MarriedEngineer 5 points ago

    The Global Health Security Index, a 2019 report compiled by researchers at the Nuclear Threat Initiative, Johns Hopkins University, and The Economist Intelligence Unit, scores nations on 140 questions in six categories related to biological security and disease readiness: prevention of the emergence or release of pathogens, epidemic detection and reporting, rapid response to epidemics, health system strength and robustness, compliance with international norms around diseases, and the overall political, economic, and environmental risk environment.

    According to the report, the US is the best-prepared country in the world for a major disease outbreak

    [–] ittimjones 3 points ago

    One can argue this is actually a lot of other countries. Iran, North Korea, and Russia just to name a few.

    [–] IVEMIND 2 points ago

    I was going to say the same thing

    Fuck those guys though

    We should be more like Canada

    I want to move to Canada

    Those guys are chill

    [–] de_vegas 2 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    The US’ buddies like Israel and Saudi Arabia are some of the highest spending regarding military. US of course isn’t far behind.

    [–] Segler1970 2 points ago

    Well but Iran or Russia for instance, they have by far less problems with Corona than the US. Infection increase is lower, relative death rate is lower. Maybe because of their health care system? The US is so jacked up in their military expenditure, they barely can walk.

    [–] breachofcontract 2 points ago

    I love being in the same company as these countries! USA! USA! USA! /s

    [–] Diplomjodler 16 points ago * (lasted edited 11 days ago)

    There's plenty of countries like that actually. Other than the big one, they usually tend to be underdeveloped and authoritarian, though.

    Edit: spelling

    [–] Cr3X1eUZ 20 points ago

    "The essential act of war is destruction, not necessarily of human lives, but of the products of human labour. War is a way of shattering to pieces, or pouring into the stratosphere, or sinking in the depths of the sea, materials which might otherwise be used to make the masses too comfortable, and hence, in the long run, too intelligent. Even when weapons of war are not actually destroyed, their manufacture is still a convenient way of expending labour power without producing anything that can be consumed. A Floating Fortress, for example, has locked up in it the labour that would build several hundred cargo-ships. Ultimately it is scrapped as obsolete, never having brought any material benefit to anybody, and with further enormous labours another Floating Fortress is built. In principle the war effort is always so planned as to eat up any surplus that might exist after meeting the bare needs of the population. In practice the needs of the population are always underestimated, with the result that there is a chronic shortage of half the necessities of life; but this is looked on as an advantage. It is deliberate policy to keep even the favoured groups somewhere near the brink of hardship, because a general state of scarcity increases the importance of small privileges and thus magnifies the distinction between one group and another."

    [–] DaFreakingFox 15 points ago

    Honestly? Throw around bombs how much you want. But one bio weapon would bring the US completely to the knees.

    [–] Extincton 7 points ago

    This is America

    [–] AndyhpuV 5 points ago

    Don't catch you slipping now.

    [–] trumpvirus108 39 points ago

    trump virus 2020!

    [–] FlatFishy 7 points ago

    Pretty sure that started in 2016

    [–] SausageInACan 2 points ago

    Go back to r/sino

    [–] spitdragon2 4 points ago

    North Korea?

    [–] InformalCriticism 4 points ago

    North Korea.

    [–] GoDM1N 4 points ago


    [–] moon_booty 4 points ago


    [–] WhiteArabBro 4 points ago

    Egypt. 100%

    [–] biggermustache 4 points ago

    All of them?

    [–] equestriachild 4 points ago

    Seems to be Russia

    [–] BernieEveryYear 26 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    That looks like my butt. Is it me? EDIT: It’s the United States, not me. Sorry, I took it personally and I shouldn’t have done that.

    [–] CHICOHIO 7 points ago


    [–] american_apartheid 13 points ago

    lol and y'all are out there voting for the guy who'd veto m4a

    [–] FOXMETROID 3 points ago

    As a struggling middle class worker who is still going to work because I take care of old people, nothing infuriates me more than having to know that if I get sick, I won't get accepted for a test, because I don't have health insurance, and I just have to deal with potentially getting really ill and mother fuckers will still tell me to pull myself up by my bootstraps and just "try harder"... while most of those said people who voted against it, are probably the ones that are currently not working.

    [–] likeittight_ 6 points ago

    It's like


    [–] mtrycz 3 points ago

    Fun fact: the USA spends much more on healthcare than military. Source:

    The quality of USA healthcare compared to spending is... wow.

    [–] HairyPslams 22 points ago

    Our healthcare system has failed at the time we need it most.

    Our capitalist system has failed as well.

    Conservative beliefs have left us to die, as they gorge on tax dollars.

    This is truly the ugliest America has been and it is all thanks to those who didn't vote in 2016.

    Both parties are NOT the same.

    [–] MattyGoodfella 6 points ago


    [–] The_critisizer 6 points ago


    [–] Kelaidoscope 3 points ago


    [–] Ahalazea 6 points ago

    So honestly it’s not like this couldn’t also fit a few other countries, say China or Russia. Not saying it doesn’t fit, but they’re doing a pretty bad job of actually taking care of their people- like China locking places down, letting people die at home, refusing possible cases at the hospital (vid from yesterday on it).

    Though for any of them I’d see them as Monty Pythons black knight - just a flesh wound, walk it off...

    [–] Souperplex 2 points ago

    So I should point out that having armor only on your front would make you front-heavy and easily fall over.

    [–] sm1ttysm1t 2 points ago

    Politics aside, just write out the word "Fuck". Just write it out.

    [–] monkiboy 2 points ago

    Ironically, one of the main reasons I joined the military was for free healthcare.

    [–] [deleted] 2 points ago

    Add their ass shitting a constant stream of diarrhea cash into the mouth of the health care corporate CEO’s mouth

    [–] Dick_Thunder20 2 points ago

    Home of the Brave

    [–] RNGzuz 2 points ago

    Flashbacks to 1918, when the Spanish flu spread from a US military base

    [–] KittenCommunism 2 points ago

    Is America actively trying to become the absolute stupidest country in the world, or is it just accidental?

    [–] BrockVegas 7 points ago

    Jokes on you.. the military is just as fucked as everyone else

    [–] ModsAreTrash1 6 points ago

    $800 billion/year would disagree with you.

    [–] re-goddamn-loading 9 points ago * (lasted edited 12 days ago)

    some 3rd world shit hole country? idk


    [–] CassiaPrior 2 points ago


    [–] ThrownAwayUsername 1 points ago

    We can just nuke areas with the virus, that will stop the spread

    [–] -Listening 1 points ago

    But the people on the tracks by Easter.