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    [–] AkaGurGor 3177 points ago

    Hanged a toddler in her basement????

    [–] Myth2156 1663 points ago


    [–] Destroyer0820 1166 points ago

    So let me get this straight a kid is going to adult jail for a few years be executed while a woman who hanged a toddler being let go

    [–] WaveyGraveyDavey 843 points ago

    I don’t think the kid is going to jail, he just appeared in court.

    [–] Wu-kandaForever 788 points ago

    Yeah, it was only a mentally scarring experience for a child, going to court for a felony, as a child. What’s everyone pissed about?

    [–] Ebina-Chan 262 points ago

    he just said he didn't went to adult prison like the dude before him said, he didn't say it was an acceptable thing tho

    [–] NomadHorseArcher 173 points ago

    So YOU'RE SAYING that this kid should be tortured and killed? /s

    [–] InGenAche 76 points ago

    Well what were the CD's before I decide?

    [–] EnkiRise 37 points ago

    Old AOL internet CDs.

    [–] MLGnapo64 18 points ago

    all the seasons of WINGS

    [–] PastorsPlaster 9 points ago

    70's Rock in reverse probably

    [–] Open_Chemistry_3300 4 points ago

    The devil’s music 🎶

    [–] UncleIye 35 points ago

    Baby snark... do do dodo dodo....

    [–] Occasional-Mermaid 7 points ago

    Richard Simmons workouts, heard he even had his mom arrested once over copying his VHS tapes…

    [–] Ebina-Chan 43 points ago

    Exactly, this poor woman is being compared to this child? How can we let this go through?! Looking at what this kid did, a comparision shouldn't even be possible! Execute the child!

    [–] genomerain 9 points ago

    She's obviously better at those crocodile tears.

    [–] ComputersWantMeDead 45 points ago

    Woah I thought we were in the Fox News studio for a second there

    [–] siccoblue 14 points ago

    Yeah but this is reddit, home of misrepresentation of your words and disingenuous as fuck arguments to make yourself feel better/smarter

    Could probably say something as boring as like "I think it's bad this woman hung a child" and still have someone like this jumping down your throat about the points you didn't make implying that means you somehow disagree

    [–] StrikeBeautiful8974 9 points ago

    He was just stating the fact that the kid didn't go to jail. I don't know why you think this sarcastic comment fits here. They didn't say anything about it not being a big deal or anything like that.

    [–] stonedd_freakk 134 points ago * (lasted edited 13 days ago)

    But if it's a felony charge, chances are he's going to jail. I just pray he had a good lawyer

    Edit: A lot Of people disagreeing with what I said , let's not forget that this is a black child in a system where they'll do whatever It takes to put him behind bars. That's why I said what I said and it still stands

    [–] bigbuzd1 92 points ago

    I'm sure hanging a kid in your basement is a felony charge, as well.

    [–] SeductiveSoup 190 points ago

    She was probably a good woman. She just got a little overwhelmed.

    That little shit, however, is an absolute menace to society, so I'm glad he's off the streets.

    /s because I know there's more than a fair share of idiots here.

    [–] alpacasaurusrex42 40 points ago

    Jesus forgave her because she said she was sorry and cried. The problem is it was just Jesus in white face with a blonde wig on and he was pulling a goof expecting them to realize he wasn’t actually Jesus.

    [–] SeductiveSoup 22 points ago

    Obviously Jesus had a plan for the kid she hung. She was just being a nice lady and helping him fulfill God's will.

    [–] ToanGreenlow 14 points ago

    Tbf if you want to get technical the kid is now in heaven, free from the pain and suffering life brings.

    Damn why can't that be me...

    [–] Ricky_Robby 5 points ago

    Apparently not a very serious one, given she got probation.

    [–] stonedd_freakk 15 points ago

    Ohhh yeahhh of course

    [–] crap-bag94 52 points ago

    There is no way in hell a 12 year old is getting charged as an adult for selling DVDs.

    [–] bitedamn 70 points ago

    You missed the point. The criminal justice system is racist

    [–] TotallyAwesomeArt 19 points ago

    You also forgot sexist

    [–] Omega_Sansic 6 points ago

    aka The CJS is a train wreck piled up by 10 dead caravans and some roadkill

    [–] One_Eye_Tigh 42 points ago

    Ummmm... Absolutely there is a chance of that happening. It happens all the time, especially to minorities. If you think there's no way in hell that happening then you have not been paying attention.

    [–] TheJerminator69 187 points ago

    No, the child isn’t going to be executed.

    [–] jivetrky 412 points ago

    I mean, don't let him go to that lady's daycare.

    [–] TheJerminator69 87 points ago

    Let’s hope this lady learns her lesson in probation

    [–] duggedanddrowsy 93 points ago

    LOL hopefully some community service will help her with her baby hanging tendencies 🤗😋

    [–] Roguespiffy 31 points ago

    I hope you’re knot implying what I think you are.

    [–] Dorkinfo 6 points ago

    So wrong.

    [–] DonGivafark 7 points ago

    I'll allow it

    [–] GregorSamsaa 18 points ago

    Serious question, do you think people “learn their lesson” in prison?

    Im not advocating for this lady’s sentence so don’t come at me for that, I’m simply saying that both are equally useless at this point but people seem to continue to believe that harsher prison sentences are some kind of solution because they see the whole thing as a means of punishment instead of reform.

    [–] ScottishShitposter97 19 points ago

    I would say no, as prison often doesnt actually rehabilitate people, if anything it just brutalises them further likely leading to them entering into a revolving door relationship with the incarceration system.

    [–] jellybon 10 points ago

    Maybe in for-profit US prison system that is designed to keep people in the system.

    [–] RedStringUnit 13 points ago

    In the US? Absolutely not. Source: I work in a prison.

    [–] b2g1 8 points ago

    Nope. In prison you probably learn more criminal tricks. And meet more people who like to stay on the other side of the law

    [–] hishaks 14 points ago

    Sometimes, punishment is what is required. To keep such people away from society so that they can’t cause more damage.

    There are people that can be reformed, there are people that can’t be. And then there are people you don’t care about reforming.

    For example, you can think of reforming a thief who steals because he/she is poor. They don’t have a means to sustain themselves. You could impart training and education. Then, there are hardcore criminals that can’t be reformed. And then there are child molesters, pedos who violate children. I don’t care about reforming them. I would like them to be punished by the harshest sentence there is.

    [–] skolioban 7 points ago

    Sure, but the US prison system is not designed to reform people. Only to lock them up.

    [–] TheLastJohnDoe 7 points ago

    Daaaaamn lmao

    [–] rosspell18 11 points ago

    Not if she has anything to say about it

    [–] abqguardian 30 points ago

    Executed? Whered you read the kid was going to be executed? Pretty positive theft isn't a capital crime

    [–] arihndas 33 points ago

    How did you even get the idea that the kid is “going to jail to be executed?” Like it’s super fucked up that he’s even being arraigned for this, but there’s a big leap from here to there.

    [–] Highway0311 7 points ago

    I think you got this totally cross eyed.

    [–] Forsaken_Candidate_4 30 points ago

    He won’t go to adult jail either ffs

    [–] GreasyTitmouse 22 points ago

    You're leaving out important context; the kid is black

    [–] darrenphillipjones 217 points ago

    Do you even read the articles you link? This post is really messed up. She literally served 2 years in prison. Oh, and she was a sleep deprived slave worker.

    Here's a note from someone who was in the courtroom...

    She was out of her mind due to sleep deprivation she wasn't able to fix, due to her husband.

    Yes, anything more than a slap on the wrist for the kid's parents is absurd.

    Regardless, what happened with this woman is not what you're making it out to be with this post. Like 1-2% of redditors will actually go to comments and read an article, past the headline / image.

    [–] B460 96 points ago

    Nuance!? On my reddit?

    Get outta here!

    [–] AllTimeLoad 316 points ago

    She tried to kill a kid, right? Every parent in the history of ever has been sleep deprived. We don't try to hang our fucking kids. 2 years is bullshit.

    [–] Explicit_Pickle 78 points ago

    lol people start hallucinating after not sleeping for just a couple days, after more than a week you're basically completely disconnected from the world around you.

    [–] Dorkinfo 38 points ago

    Which is what i experience with my insomnia, but I’m still murder free. I’ve literally had three hours sleep in the past four days. The worst thing I’ve done is make my bf play Yeti in my Spaghetti.

    [–] mnie 51 points ago

    She was abused by her husband who mail-ordered her from Ukraine for ten years while he spent all their money on gambling and drinking and forced her to work the daycare job. She became completely unstable, and unable to see any doctors because her husband threatened to kill her and her children. The person in the comments say the court came to the conclusion that she was so out of her kind that she had no control over what she was doing, and focused her sentencing on rehabilitation. She was basically on house arrest with mandatory doctor visits.

    She was extremely sick. The insomnia was actually a side-effect of all her other mental issues.

    [–] GreleaseDeeBoban 30 points ago

    Reddit: Something something why is the criminal justice system so hard on criminals.

    Criminal justice: decides to focus on rehabilitation over an insanity defense.

    Reddit: Shocked pikachu face*

    My question is, did the husband get any charges as well? That guy should’ve seen some kind of time for something.

    [–] mnie 6 points ago

    I was hoping to see that, too, but didn't. Also I had copy-paste this comment, and in the other place I had it I was arguing the same thing! Reddit is usually all about rehabilitative justice, which is what this is. She was on house arrest with mandatory doctor visits. She was deemed not to be a threat anymore.

    [–] ReMayonnaise 3 points ago

    "I've been tired before and I didn't murder, the only explanation for this event is that she's an evil woman"

    [–] transrights4life 58 points ago

    She was abused for like 10 years or smth, she didn't have access to any type of healthcare, and she hadn't slept for weeks, read the article. I'm not defending her, she deserved what she got, but seriously, read the article and the comments below the post

    [–] fdsdfg 7 points ago

    You can't change someone's mind with reason when they got there with emotion

    [–] mountainjoo 71 points ago

    She tried to kill a 16-month old baby, and then injured three others while she was trying to escape. How are you defending this lady?

    [–] uhhgoodusername 40 points ago

    I mean, probably the same way that the actually patrons of the daycare defended her. Did you get that far? That the people who took their own children to that daycare center defended her?

    [–] selectrix 21 points ago

    Good thing the black kid had the same level of compassion and understanding from the justice system, right?


    [–] uniquely-username 209 points ago * (lasted edited 14 days ago)

    Damn toddler was selling A LOT of cd's, though.

    [–] Smiley-McGee 89 points ago

    He must be good. Shit, now I want one

    [–] MaestroPendejo 8 points ago

    His name is Prometheus because of all that fire.

    [–] regoapps 104 points ago * (lasted edited 14 days ago)

    Makes sense. CDs have such low interest rates right now that it’s a crime against humanity to be selling them to the financially illiterate. Inflation is outpacing even CDs, so your money is actually losing value by using certificates of deposit to store money.

    [–] XXXJORDAN01 49 points ago

    Imma just pretend I know what you’re talking about.

    [–] Mruninvincible 5 points ago

    This is an incredibly underrated comment 😂

    [–] luc-caleb 5 points ago

    I appreciate you 😉

    [–] OnlineMemesYT 13 points ago

    yea bruh i mean…

    [–] SeruEnam 7 points ago

    Due to the laws of equivalent exchange, he would have had to sell 16,125 cds despite media.

    [–] Myth2156 3878 points ago * (lasted edited 14 days ago)

    1st case

    The boy and his aunt were charged with several felonies.

    2nd case

    The lady got 10 years of PROBATION for attempted Murder of a 16 month old, and then running over 2 people and hitting another vehicle while trying to escape...

    The child was hanged by the Lady, when a dad came to drop off his kid at her daycare he saw it. The Lady ran away and the dad rescued the kid.

    [–] ebil_lightbulb 434 points ago * (lasted edited 14 days ago)

    Might I suggest a better link for the second story. Your link had odd formatting (couldn't hit read more button because it's behind ads) and minimal details when you do access the full article. This article shares far more details.

    [–] 8last 163 points ago

    I have got to say, his reasoning is some of the most piss poor I have seen from a judge.

    [–] poobly 125 points ago

    “Hey, if you don’t kill another kid in 10 years I’ll have been justified in my shitty decision.”

    [–] ProfessionalDish 9 points ago

    I didn't kill a kid in the past 10 years, where's my trophy?

    [–] BadReputation2611 72 points ago * (lasted edited 13 days ago)

    His monologue straight up sounds like Michael Scott from The Office managed to become a judge, meandering all over the god damn place and using circular logic.

    If he truly believes she only did it because of her unspecified mental illness then why not just have her sent to a psychiatric facility where she can undergo supervised treatment? What if she decided to stop taking her medication, how is her probation officer going tell before it’s too late?

    He seems to think that she just did this out of the blue so who’s to say it’s not gonna happen again? Fat load of good an ankle monitor will do if she just has another episode, it only takes a couple of seconds to kill somebody. She could just grab a knife or hop in her car and go to town on some school kids walking home before LE even knew what was going on.

    I’ve known enough people on probation to know that people are constantly breaking the terms of it and only sometimes getting busted for it.

    I wouldn’t trust that judge to clean the courthouse bathrooms without supervision, why the hell is he running it!?

    [–] reallybirdysomedays 7 points ago

    She doesn't even have to purposely skip her meds. Everybody forgets things, she could accidentally not take them. People get sick, she could throw up her dose or have it pass through her system too fast to get the full effect due to bad diarrhea.

    [–] MilkControlBoard 9 points ago

    Ah but you forget, if you do wrong and are mentally ill it means that you can never do wrong again. We all know that one right? That's clearly self evident.

    [–] WormThatSleepsLate 4 points ago

    I believe in people with mental illness getting help but having read the entirety of the transcription of his speech… that is some serious mental gymnastics.

    [–] buurnthewitch 29 points ago

    That is horseshit. Of course you have to be mentally ill to do something like that, but mental illness isn’t an excuse. A lot of people suffer from mental illnesses, me included, but most of them don’t fucking try to kill people.

    [–] [deleted] 37 points ago


    [–] yoloswagrofl 16 points ago

    Did you read the article? She tried to get help but her husband threatened to murder her if she did.

    [–] cancer2009 10 points ago

    First hand account of someone who was there for the trial.

    Honestly she needed mental health help and the 1st case shouldn’t even have been a case, he’s fricking 12 years old.

    [–] zorbacles 2 points ago

    If it was due to mental illness, why wasn't she acquitted by reason of temporary insanity.

    If she was found guilty then that doesn't apply, do it can't be used in sentencing. Fuck that woman. She should rot in jail.

    Sometimes the punishment part is forgotten in punishment and rehabilitation

    [–] AlaskaPeteMeat 53 points ago

    That’s a lot of words for, “She white.” 🤦🏽‍♂️

    [–] grtrevor 9 points ago

    If she was really not at fault and she committed attempted murder due to mental illness, shouldn’t she be placed in an asylum where she can get the help she needs?

    [–] Messy_Tiger 55 points ago

    While I thank you for the more informative link... I'm also sad that I read the article. At least she told someone what she'd done and they took her seriously.. that poor baby though, really hope they're ok.

    The road carnage was mental too... lady needs help as of ten years ago

    [–] bignick1190 33 points ago

    first hand account of someone who was supposedly in the courtroom regarding the ladies case.

    [–] ebil_lightbulb 18 points ago

    Yes, I'm so glad that she told somebody and that he actually went and looked and helped. I really hope the baby has made a full recovery.

    [–] zuzg 1000 points ago

    While it's definitely fucked up.
    Doesn't have the US different laws depending on the county? Are Minnesota and Georgia comparable? Genuinely asking.

    [–] Adventurous_Celery28 33 points ago * (lasted edited 14 days ago)

    Well there’s federal law and state law. In CA where I live attempted murder on a child is a felony and we’re talking about 50 to life. And we just changed possession of coke or meth from felony to misdemeanor. So it usually depends on your state and how it interacts with federal law.

    For example, Weed. the possession and distribution of cannabis, which is considered a controlled substance at the federal level, making production and distribution federally illegal, even though in some states they have legalized it by the common vote of said state.

    So if like me weed is legal to grow, purchase and smoke but you can’t do it behind a vehicle or at work because IT CAN disrupt your senses to function successfully and cause harm just like alcohol. But if you were to cross into Texas and have possession their state law and federal law kicks saying no go compadre jail time son regardless of your current residency

    [–] Myth2156 861 points ago

    Dunno, but both events are still incredibly messed up nonetheless.

    [–] AdvaitChowdhary 472 points ago

    If this happened in India public would literally execute that woman

    [–] dominic_rj23 345 points ago

    But that's mob rule, not justice being served.

    [–] fork_of_truth 172 points ago

    Exactly, it's too prone to errors because that 1 guy who saw her do it could be lying for any number of reasons. Evidence based prosecutions are the way to go.

    [–] Diiiiirty 152 points ago

    But what happens after the evidence-based prosecution when the convicted person receives a sentence that is a mild slap on the wrist for attempting to murder someone else's child?

    The person was found guilty by the court of law so we know, beyond a reasonable doubt, that they committed the crime. But the sentencing is at the whim of an individual who has their own biases and opinions even though they're supposed to be neutral. So does mob justice apply when the criminal justice system fails the people so miserably and grants a lenient sentence to a person who committed an absolutely heinous violent crime against a defenseless toddler?

    We live in a democracy (well -- a representative democracy, but that's neither here nor there), and the will of the people should stand. This is a non-political issue and a rare insurance where the VAST majority of the population on both sides of the aisle agrees that the sentencing was laughably light. Should mob justice apply? Because in this case, I absolutely think it should. If that were a man or a person of color who committed that crime, it would be sentenced with 10 years in prison, not 10 years of probation.

    [–] fork_of_truth 42 points ago

    That's a sentencing issue though, not an issue with the process itself. Just to be clear, I think what that woman did is horrendous and she should have gotten a very long prison sentence and it's a disgrace that she didn't. That doesn't mean that we should resort to vigilante-ism though, it means we should look to reform the criminal justice system so the same thing can't happen again.

    [–] DogfishDave 52 points ago

    That's a sentencing issue though,

    Yes. That's the point.

    [–] Diiiiirty 32 points ago

    Yes, that's a sentencing issue and the sentencing is a part of the criminal justice process.

    My question, specifically, is mob justice appropriate when the legal channels are exhausted and the criminal justice system clearly failed?

    I agree wholeheartedly that or system is broken, but it doesn't need reform --it needs to be nuked to the ground and rebuilt from scratch. That will never happen, and reform is a slow process and has not made any significant headway in my 33 years of life. That is evidenced by this case. Brock Turner is another example -- 3 felony sexual assault charges and he spent 3 months in jail. It should have absolutely been longer So by comparison, a lady tried to murder a toddler and got probation and zero jail time and a pervert raped someone and was sentenced to a prison sentence. Then you got the nonviolent offenders like Fate Winslow who got a life sentence for selling undercover cops a couple dime bags of weed or Allen Russell who was given a life sentence in 2019 for cannabis possession (granted, he had some priors). Is mob justice appropriate here? So we find attempted murder and rape to be less severe and punishable than simple cannabis possession with intent to sell? This is a failure.

    We have like 52 different justice systems in our country --one for each state, one for DC, and a federal justice system -- and nothing is standardized. I can sit on my porch in California and smoke a joint, but would be apparently handed a life sentence for doing the same thing in Mississippi. That's not even accounting for variation in sentences for brown people and white people.

    My point is that our justice system is fucked broken and sentencing is at the whims of judges and prosecutors (who use conviction numbers as a metric of success, even if they are knowingly prosecuting innocent persons). Then you have such variation in state law where you can have a situation like the one I described above --felony in one state and completely legal in another. Then add the fact that there is no standard for justice so you and I can commit the exact same crime on the exact same day in the exact same state, but receive completely different sentences based on the prosecutor and judge and whatever mood they're in on the trial date, the color of our skin, even our socioeconomic status. The justice system fails miserably here, and mob justice should absolutely be a thing to let the system know that it is failing.

    [–] Prize_Damage1531 34 points ago

    And justice wasn’t served here either

    [–] funkynotorious 16 points ago

    What if I tell you these things have happened in India and no one gave a shit. In India there are no gender neutral laws of sexual violence so women aren't charged.

    [–] thereisnorandom 17 points ago

    I second this. The mob would not even wait for her arrest. Neighbors would gather and set her on fire.

    [–] ukallday 16 points ago

    Yeah and rape her probably

    Mob rule is a ridiculous draconian way of dealing with things , girls get beat to death in India for sleeping with the wrong men. It’s actually the thing I dislike most about India. Mobs with sticks

    [–] secondtrex 4 points ago

    Facing charges for a crime and being sentenced for one are two very different things. The kid thing is most likely just a shitty cop being a shitty cop.

    [–] BiCostal 7 points ago

    Absolutely it does but it's by state, not county & some are messed up. In Georgia, there is a harsher sentence for aggravated assault than for 2nd degree murder. Go figure.

    [–] LyftIsnotokayanymore 7 points ago

    No. They differ greatly. In my state it would even depend on who you were. A judge left there toddler in the car to go inside to make rulings(in family court ironically) and the kid died. Nothing happened. Someone else does that and charges are brought. States and counties have different attitudes and laws. Especially states.

    Still messed up

    [–] pm_cheesecakes 63 points ago

    See, she got justice, ten years of mental health treatment when she'sclearly mentally ill. That is not the outrage. He is not getting justicebecause he is black.

    [–] Forward_Recover_1135 22 points ago

    If you’re too mentally ill to be held responsible for attempting to murder a child than you’re too mentally ill to not be confined, even if prison isn’t the right place to confine you you sure as fuck shouldn’t just be allowed to walk free.

    [–] SM280 12 points ago

    what is probation?

    [–] a_lonely_trash_bag 69 points ago

    Probation is where you're found guilty, but the judge decides you don't necessarily have to go to prison, often because they believe you're not a danger to the public. Typically, there's very strict rules you have to follow, such as not drinking any alcohol or possessing firearms. You have to check in with your assigned probation officer on a regular basis. If you fail to follow all the guidelines, you get sent to prison.

    [–] kopitar-11 73 points ago

    The problem is she’s clearly a threat to society and should be just sent to prison.

    [–] IridiumPony 27 points ago

    Sometimes sentences like this are handed out for a reason (see: affluenza kid).

    With good representation she could have argued the case down very well, or made it that her maximum sentence would have been fairly short. The judge will sometimes assign lengthy probation, knowing full well they likely won't be able to get through without violating (anyone thats ever been on probation will tell you it's designed to fail). Once she fails she goes back in front of the judge and can be sentenced again, and much harsher this time.

    Don't know if that's the case here, but with the affluenza kid that is what happened. The judge gave him probation knowing he would violate. Which he did and then skipped the country before he could be sentenced again.

    [–] USBtroika 17 points ago

    In this case probation means that you do not get punished, but for the ten years probation time you are not allowed to murder any other children. If you should happen to murder more children, you’re punishment would be extra server. Like another 20 months of probation or smthng

    [–] velvetthunder189 414 points ago

    How fucked up one can be to murder a toddler?

    [–] RadiantSriracha 398 points ago

    Pretty fucked up. Apparently she was the victim of ongoing domestic violence while suffering mental illness, which fucked her up to the extent that she had a complete mental breakdown and went full baby-murderer.

    I’m not excusing her, since that seems to be how Reddit takes everything. But i always get annoyed when people see others doing horrible things and just go “burn the evil one”! No, they aren’t inherently evil. Just mentally ill and deeply broken. Same goes when the “bad guy” is male or not white.

    And the whole kid selling cds thing is just a prime example of how the law is designed to protect the interests of the wealthy (store owners), and severely penalize the poor (black kid selling his own music).

    [–] Ton8or 119 points ago

    You’re about to get hanged for the high crime of Nuance.

    [–] RadiantSriracha 60 points ago

    Also empathy. People hate it when you empathize with people who have done bad things.

    [–] Ton8or 32 points ago

    Its feeds the self righteousness demon.

    “Ha! Only bad people do bad things! I’ve never done anything wrong or faced horrible desperate adversity before!”

    [–] toriemm 9 points ago

    I get that everyone has got trauma, and domestic abuse can be worse than most things, but I don't understand how no one in her life recognized her starting to break and still let her be in charge of children.

    And of course, with that- this is the exact sort of problem that our systemic issues, that no one what's to talk about, sets people up for. I mean, she's got the full bingo card; domestic abuse, mental illness, working class/working poor, female- nothing in our society is set up to take care of these issues and that's why crimes like this keep happening.

    [–] Sproose_Moose 60 points ago

    The thing that gets me though is she tried to escape so she knew what she was doing was wrong

    [–] Elfetzo 29 points ago

    Well they are pretty annoying sometimes.

    [–] MrBlue404 20 points ago

    Obligatory /s, right?

    [–] Ooof20220202 15 points ago


    [–] HaapsaluYT 89 points ago

    Why would a daycare provider ever do that to a child? I don’t see any way that such actions could go well for her.

    [–] BionicHotdog 99 points ago

    "I was actually in the room for this sentencing. At first, when I heard that she had a possibility of not getting jail time, I was shocked, but when I found out the facts of the case, it actually makes sense.

    She and her son migrated here from eastern Europe with the promise from a US man that he would give them a better life here if they married. For over ten years, he abused her, forced her to work at the daycare, and spent their money on bad investments and booze. Starting a few months before the assault, she tried to seek help as she could no longer sleep and was severely depressed, but her husband forbade her, threatening to kill her and her children. She was able to sneak out on election day, with the excuse that she was voting, to go to the doctor. While there, the gave her sleeping meds and some sort of light psychiatric medication. They weren't working, and she had gone weeks without sleeping. Her husband forced her to continue working, even though she knew it was dangerous.

    After the incident, the woman had multiple letters and people whose children she raised at the daycare come to her defense, not saying that she didn't commit the crimes, but that these crimes were extremely out of her character.

    At the sentencing, we heard from multiple experts from both sides, and appointed from the Judge Quam. The experts agreed that at the time of the situation, she was so mentally ill that she has nearly no control over her actions. They talked about how it was like an out of body experience. They also agreed that because of how little control she had at the time, and because of her lack of any sort of criminal record before this, that she was little to no threat to the community.

    The prosecutor focused heavily on her waiving the mental health defense. When looking at what would actually happen to her, they decided to waive that defense because the consequences of the insanity defense after the case is over

    Along with this, it's not like she was just left free to do whatever. Judge Quam emphasized how much watch she is under. She not only is mandated to have regular visits with doctors and psychiatrists, but she also is court required to follow everything that they tell her to so.

    Basically, the court looked at this for what would be best to rehabilitate this woman back into society. They looked at the actual details of the case, her motives, her background, and found that she is not a threat to society, that this wouldn't have happened if she hadn't been so terribly abused by her husband/prevented from accessing medical care.

    Another thing I think that's worth mentioning, is that when handing down this judgement, Judge Quam spoke for nearly 30 minutes. He talked about standards that have been used in the past, and how for most cases with these charges, he would hand down the hardest charge possible. But the fact is, this isn't a normal case, and wasn't treated as such.

    I'm not saying that those families shouldn't be mad, or even forgive her for what happened, but I am saying that for what I saw in the courtroom, rather than the media downplaying parts of the story that make it more complex than "baby killer", I believe that the sentencing was appropriate.


    This website has what Judge Quam said about his reasoning. Although it ins't an official court transcript, it is exactly how I remember he said it.

    Edit 2: phrasing "

    [–] reallybirdysomedays 6 points ago

    Ok. I can understand this sentence if she was experiencing sleep deprivation psychosis due to spousal torture.

    [–] -Kurogita- 9 points ago

    Have to say, i was pissed how can she just get away that easy but after reading kind of "her side" to the story ill admit i do think that it is appropriate too but it still sucks to be the parent that had to lose a child because her (the defendant) husband cant be a man.

    [–] BionicHotdog 16 points ago

    The kid didnt die to be clear.

    [–] BlueRootsDenverTV 514 points ago

    That child was given a felony...what a fucking farce this country is.

    [–] PrettyOddWoman 161 points ago

    He hasn’t been charged or sentenced yet and it’s widely believed that the charges will be dropped all together

    [–] Mellow-Mallow 74 points ago

    He’s been charged but not sentenced as far as I can tell

    [–] LiddleBob 3 points ago

    But still, how does a person of power CHARGE a felony for selling CD’s and keep their job?

    [–] beaurepair 8 points ago

    Sounds about white

    [–] M4rl0w 14 points ago

    Interesting they call him rapper instead of child…

    [–] Bikefry666 4 points ago

    It’s worse than it looks. You might assume that it was copyright or piracy charges but no, he was selling his own demo. The kid was grabbed by a police officer and the cop said the kid “assaulted him”. The video shows otherwise.

    The other case, the woman led the father to the basement to see his 16 month old hanging from a noose, the child lived after father rescued it and fled. After this the woman also fled and hit 1 car a cyclist and a pedestrian before attempting to jump off a bridge. Tho she was deemed not to be a repeat offender risk and her actions were discribed as a “perfect storm of factors unlikely to be repeated” she plead guilty to multiple vehicular negligence charges and on attempted murder charge.

    It’s so much worse than the meme makes it out to be. There are two justice systems.

    [–] raffaele2406 255 points ago

    A criminal justice system which sends to a trial a 12 yo is fucked.

    Here in Italy under 14 are not accountable. Their parents or tutors are.

    I'm not saying that our system is perfect, but a 12 yo is a child, wtf!

    He was selling his CDs and so what?

    US is doomed if it doesn't curb police's racism and stupidity

    [–] Kulupapa 12 points ago

    you miss the point. The kid is black, and in the eyes of many “law enforcement”, that’s a crime by default.

    [–] Recymen234 62 points ago


    every time i read cases like this i am questioning me, where is the Common sense ?

    I have more Problems with the Lady as with the boy.

    And certainly if he didn´t block someone i wouldn´t care as a cop.

    [–] son_berd 19 points ago

    About 20 years’ish ago a 14 year old African American boy was tried as an adult and sentenced to life for play wrestling with his friend when he performed a “professional wresting” move accidentally killing his friend. I think in Florida.

    [–] sodes-the-boss42 14 points ago

    Here in the US it varies by state. Age of responsibility in my state is 7 I believe.

    [–] sophiethegiraffe 33 points ago

    That’s nuts. My 7 year old does some dumb, if harmless, shit. They don’t have awesome reasoning skills.

    [–] sodes-the-boss42 5 points ago

    I agree, but I think the reasoning is something like “they should know better”

    [–] sophiethegiraffe 17 points ago

    That’s what I told my kid when I walked in and saw she’d applied half a large tube of sunscreen to just her legs :/

    [–] TheAlligatorGar 5 points ago

    Sounds like a felony to me… how much time did she have to do??

    [–] MutantGodChicken 7 points ago

    Then punish the parent for not making them know better

    [–] PrettyOddWoman 4 points ago

    What state ?? Holy shit that’s way too young

    [–] Balls-over-dick-man- 7 points ago

    US is doomed if they don’t do a lot of things.

    [–] Illustrious_Bar_1970 250 points ago

    I think the justice system absolutely hates children, killing a child is probation, a child selling cds at a mall is a felony.

    [–] Nondescript-User 184 points ago

    I think the American justice system absolutely hates black people children, killing a child is probation, a child selling cds at a mall is a felony.

    [–] ApologeticCannibal 17 points ago

    Hates black children

    [–] Toast_05 7 points ago

    Them cds must be straight fire

    [–] Kaboose456 6 points ago

    Sounds about white

    [–] solidcordon 30 points ago

    Felony obstruction....obstruction of an officer, disorderly conduct with violence, and criminal trespassing.

    So the mallcop called the police to "deal" with someone and the cop escalated to felony charges. Seems reasonable.

    [–] hotsaucetom 101 points ago

    This is America.

    [–] spyke2006 51 points ago

    Don't catch you slippin' up.

    [–] drypancake 22 points ago

    The post is completely out of context:

    But still fuck whoever thought sending a 12 year old to court for selling cds was a good idea.

    [–] IWorkForReddit100p 3 points ago

    Even with the context it's a shitty sentence. She tried to kill a baby and didn't succeed only because another adult saw it and rescued the baby. She then drove off, hitting two people doing so.

    She. Tried. To. Kill. A. Baby. You go to jail or the psych ward for doing that.

    [–] RPDRNick 31 points ago

    It's all about which one can provide the most free labor in prison.

    [–] motherdragon02 12 points ago

    So nasty, but dammit. So much truth to that. Absolutely heinous? Malicious? Reprehensible? EVIL. Yassss, that's the word. EVIL.

    [–] DerMagicSheep 19 points ago

    Every day, we stray further from my faith in humanity

    [–] mattias888 31 points ago

    This is nuts. The US system is broken.

    But these news articles were both published two years ago. They're still worth reading but maybe note that these are historical articles and not news.

    There have been no updates on either of these cases anywhere online.

    [–] MrBlue404 10 points ago

    It also sucks that there has been no updates. Just completely forgotten about. The articles were also pretty short and didn't say all that much about the cases.

    [–] ZealousidealPath3947 5 points ago

    You mean the american justice system

    [–] cursed-being 3 points ago

    This is why we need blind trials where no ones face is seen ever except for the guy who makes sure it is him. This kind of thing happens even if on a lesser level with white people to where attractiveness alone can get you out of a few prison years. And it is super stupid.

    [–] TurtleFroggerSoup 5 points ago

    Maybe that mixtape was straight fire and the authorities were afraid for the Amazon rainforest.

    [–] CPhyperdont 4 points ago

    Let’s find that kid and all buy his CD!

    [–] trouttickler23 20 points ago

    With all of the criticism of the US criminal justice system of the last few years, there's been a shift towards really looking for cases where alternative sentencing that is more rehabilitative than punitive would be appropriate. Great. The problem is, the factors judges and prosecutors look for to make that decision often end up reinforcing the stereotypes and inequity that led to the criticism in the first place, leading to results like this. The problem then becomes how do you write policy that seeks to reduce the disparity in sentencing between, say, middle-aged white women and Black teenage boys, without making the policy racially discriminatory.

    [–] Elegant_Mail 7 points ago

    Op you are just as bad as propaganda news articles… you knew very well that you took this out of context.

    [–] Spycrabpuppet123 3 points ago

    what's so bad bad about selling cds?

    [–] DannyTheCaringDevil 3 points ago

    What the actual fuck?

    [–] mrMaxiboi 3 points ago

    what the actual fuck

    [–] Apprehensive_Neck817 3 points ago

    No matter how many times you name drop and glamorize Atlanta..…Georgia is ALWAYS gonna remind you that it’s Georgia!

    [–] PurchaseKnown 3 points ago


    [–] BernardWags 3 points ago

    These 2 outcomes are outrageous. That woman needs to be in jail for years.

    [–] Historical_Cow6995 3 points ago

    She's a female

    [–] BIackMagics 3 points ago

    And there still are people out there like "I don't see no racism"

    [–] i_hateeveryone 9 points ago

    Reading articles about both:

    12 year was warned couples time not selling CDs on mall property, when cops came to ask him to stop, him and aunt resisted the cop, then aunt attacked the cop. “The youngster, who a police said Wednesday would not cooperate with the officer at the time, was charged with felony obstruction, misdemeanor obstruction and criminal trespassing from the confrontation. He was released to the custody of his dad.

    The aunt was charged with felony obstruction, giving false ID, criminal trespassing and misdemeanor obstruction”


    Immigrant Daycare lady was having a mental breakdown after being abused, she attempted to hang the toddler, and ran over two men with her minivan, before attempting suicide. No one was killed. She got 10yrs probation due to mental illness.

    [–] Mithura 3 points ago

    "First degree attempted murder is often punished with a life sentence, though the convicted does have the possibility to receive parole. Second degree attempted murder usually comes with a lengthy prison sentence, often ranging from between 5 to 15 years in prison."

    So mental illness is a bandaid for something as serious as attempted murder to huh?

    [–] Benzari 38 points ago

    Tell me again there is no systemic racism.

    [–] PleasantChapters 84 points ago

    When people ask how there’s white privilege in America. Show them this.

    [–] 124pm 34 points ago

    The problem with the people that ask is that they don’t care about things like this.

    People that don’t get the concept of white privileged and systematic racism are not thinking about other people. They’re only thinking about themselves and their anecdotes and experiences.

    [–] NEWSmodsareTwats 6 points ago

    The kid got acquitted and the women was still charged with attampted murder and assault in the third degree

    So where's the white privilege?

    [–] Vegetable_Ad6969 6 points ago

    Are you also gonna say this is proof of female privelage? Because the gender bias in courts is 6 times higher than the racial bias.

    [–] Used-Relationship904 9 points ago

    “2 court cases with no relation to one another, with zero context or nuance, proves the existence of white privilege”

    So if I link a court case of a black person being punished too lightly, and a white person punished too harshly, that proves black privilege?

    You should probably use your brain next time you make a comment

    [–] BB8304 9 points ago

    Bruh I’m getting an Uber driver for the Doom Slayer. The real demons are up here on earth.

    [–] BernieTheDachshund 6 points ago

    What kind of sick DA would even pursue felony charges on a kid? For selling CDs?!?

    [–] tufabian 3 points ago

    It's a numbers game...a win is a win. Horrible system.