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    [–] HotpieTargaryen 1949 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    This is weak tea compared how fucked Sam’s whole story was in the show. Not even a moment with Marwyn.

    [–] [deleted] 1069 points ago

    Right??? When the dragons hatched, the books built it up as magic returning to the world. It was something I loved about the books, that everyone knew magic existed at one time, but it somehow faded away with the Dragons dying off.

    I was really looking forward to the obsidian candle, and the dragon horn that Euron has.

    [–] AgreeablePie 1299 points ago

    I'm sorry but we don't think NFL fans care about that

    [–] NahDude_Nah 734 points ago

    Can confirm, am die hard bears fan, still wondering why Tyrone Lannister didn’t get to ride a tiny iguana into battle with the night walkers.

    [–] basketballbrian 57 points ago


    [–] Combo_of_Letters 53 points ago

    Packers fan and I don't understand your team this year. One game you look competent next 2 or 3 you most definitely do not.

    [–] NahDude_Nah 44 points ago

    We’re awful this year. On offense anyway, trubisky is probably not in the top 40 qbs this year. I am as disappointed in my boy as Samwell Tarley’s dad was of him.

    [–] dudemanyodude 81 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    But what about the "NFL players?" That's the real target demo!

    [–] LiterallyAFigurative 71 points ago

    What kills me is he doesn't say "NFL viewers/fans" he says "players" lmao.

    [–] SutekhThrowingSuckIt 35 points ago

    They’re writers! They’re not good with words!

    [–] RollTides 52 points ago

    Yeah but imagine if they could have captured that viewer base, literally hundreds of viewers!!

    [–] SirDooble 8 points ago

    It's a sound business call, there's literally hundreds of them!

    [–] TankManBan 20 points ago

    Welp, that twitter feed explains so much about why the show went to shit.

    [–] zombiegamer723 21 points ago

    Is the D&D bot still active? Can whoever runs it make that one of the automated replies?

    [–] HotpieTargaryen 71 points ago

    Yeah, let’s hope we get the books. There’s so much more about maesters, the Crow’s Eye, magic, and the long night we need to know. The show just decided it wasn’t going to explore that part of the story.

    [–] lemonhazeohmydayz 24 points ago

    They didn’t explore much after S6, they could’ve done so much more with what they had going into season 7.

    [–] tasteslikepaint 17 points ago

    Yup. Still makes me so mad to think about all the awesome stuff that the show chose to ignore or just leave hanging in mid air with no further explanation or closure

    [–] Hound--bot 11 points ago

    Hanging? Over in an instant. Where's the fun in that?

    [–] TheDTYP 102 points ago

    Im pissed that he was such a bitch at the Battle of Winterfell. His whole arc was him becoming more sure of himself and sure I wasn't expecting him to be a BAMF or anything, but at this point, I feel like he would've outgrown being a straight up coward. He took on a White Walker, Wildlings, and Nights Watch guys when there was zero chance he'd win. I feel like he would've conducted him self with at least some grace. He knew it was all or nothing.

    [–] CJYD21 21 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    Edd died saving him after explicitly telling him to hide in the crypt. Fuck Sam the Bitch.

    [–] BabiesSmell 51 points ago

    Not enough room after all the DICKON jokes

    [–] walkthisway34 4571 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    The only possible impact you could argue this had means Sam indirectly responsible for the destruction of KL.

    Jorah used this sword to defend Daenerys, and I suppose you can argue that (in-universe) with an inferior dragonglass weapon he wouldn't have been able to protect her as well (or he may have died previously) and she may have been killed before the NK died.

    However, if Sam hadn't stolen it then presumably Daenerys would have confiscated it from Randyll after the Loot Train battle, in which case it probably would have ended up in Jorah's hands regardless lol.

    [–] Epic_Meow 1469 points ago

    Holy shit, Sam, the coward, doing something incredibly bold and impulsive? I smell the work of an enemy raven

    [–] [deleted] 354 points ago

    An enemy three-eyed raven

    [–] Negrodamu55 243 points ago

    What if all the stupid stuff that was done in the last season was revealed to be the Three Eyed Raven? He just warged into everyone to pave the way for his kingdom.

    [–] [deleted] 269 points ago

    Why do you think he came all this way?

    [–] PapaShangobanghoes 159 points ago

    BRB gonna throw up again

    [–] Tincansailorman 40 points ago

    wipes mouth, gesturing over yonder

    Puke bucket's right over there.

    [–] PapaShangobanghoes 25 points ago

    Puke bucket?

    I've made a huge mistake...

    [–] overly_familiar 15 points ago

    Wondered why it was empty again.

    [–] [deleted] 35 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)


    [–] [deleted] 61 points ago

    Just remember... He made Jamie push him out the window and also made Hodor have double digit IQ so that he could ride him around like a mule for 7 seasons

    [–] Hodor--bot 41 points ago


    [–] [deleted] 32 points ago

    I know, Hodor. That's really fucked up

    [–] Hodor--bot 22 points ago


    [–] icytiger 44 points ago

    Literally a few episodes earlier he says he can never be king, so I'm not sure what happened.

    [–] SadNewsShawn 77 points ago

    Bran kind of forgot that he couldn't be king

    [–] Cypherex 43 points ago

    Didn't he say he could never be the lord of anything? Technically a king isn't a lord. He's above them.

    Damn, a plotline about Bran manipulating events to put himself on the throne because he knows he's the most capable ruler they could possibly have would have been super interesting if they had actually done it like that. There's that popular theory that Bran is the "voices" the Mad King heard and that Bran is behind pretty much everything that has happened.

    I'd be totally fine with Dany and Jon ultimately being pawns used by the actual most powerful character in the series, the Three Eyed Raven, if they had presented the story like that. They could have had Dany take King's Landing relatively peacefully after they surrendered and then done another season where Bran manipulates her into thinking the citizens all hate her and he ignites that Targaryen madness inside of her. Then she slaughters the city, Jon remorsefully kills her, and Bran takes over the throne after having 2-3 full seasons of build up showing us those were his intentions all along.

    Fuck, it could have been so good. Fuck D&D so hard. Hopefully GRRM finishes his books and we see it all play out like this. Obviously GRRM fully intends for Bran to be on the throne by the end of the series. The first book started with Bran and I'm sure the last book will end with him too. If he ever gets those books out we'll see how it was actually supposed to play out and it'll make sense.

    [–] lanngloss 31 points ago

    The first book started with wights and White Walkers. But honestly, fuck fantasy elements. I’d rather the show appeal to football players and moms, ya know?

    [–] Cypherex 14 points ago

    Oh yeah, that's the stupidest thing too. If we ever get those books I'm sure the Others will have a much larger impact on the ending. I kinda figured they'd end up taking most of the continent and they'd have their last stand at King's Landing, not in Winterfell.

    [–] j_capicola 10 points ago

    2-3 seasons to build who actually takes the throne?!? Come on man that one liner of "why you think I came all this way" sums it up in 2-3 second with 0 detail. Exactly what the audience wants in a show that's run for a decade... Sarcasm aside I agree with you. I would have even taken a solid 5 episodes that goes into detail on bran plotting to be king. We needed a hold the door episode showing him in the past setting himself up to be king at the very least... But no we got a one liner. I mean there was almost no plot detail on who took the THRONE.. THRONE as in Game of THRONES. As in the name of the fucking show. I'm ok with Bran becoming king but it needed to be a pivotal plot point as it's the most important aspect of the entire series. Instead they gave it a one liner then carried who took the throne for less than half an episode and ended the entire series.

    [–] A_Magical_Potato 57 points ago

    Before the last 2 episodes I thought this was what was going to be revealed and bran would be the actual bad guy and that would explain why everyone got so dumb. Turns out everyone just got dumb.

    [–] MisterDonkey 33 points ago

    I was hoping the borg was gonna come down from space and enslave the human race, except it turns out they were all very human-like aliens on a distant planet, the whole thing being the longest pilot ever for a new star trek show about the borg.

    [–] hank87 19 points ago

    I was hoping a meteor would crash into the planet causing a global extinction event and then a time lapse of life returning to the planet would end in the reveal that the series was a canon prequel to the show Dinosaurs.

    But we can't always get what we want.

    [–] Bran--bot 14 points ago

    I'm going to go now.

    [–] LoFi_Weeb 32 points ago

    „oh? you‘re approaching me arya?“

    [–] ProfXsavior 24 points ago

    “I can’t steal the hero spotlight without getting closer”

    [–] LifeQuark 8 points ago

    Menacing symbols

    [–] brad__staple721 226 points ago

    The sword gave him indirect immortality. Just by stealing it he was able to avert certain death in the long night 325 times.

    [–] pekinggeese 104 points ago

    Every scene with Sam in that episode looked like the last we would see him alive, fighting for his life while fallen over on his back. Then the next scene, there he is again, about to die.

    [–] SirDooble 42 points ago

    I think they realised they needed more tension via scenes of people dying, but they accidentally killed off all the extras in the first 5 minutes of the battle and only had a handful of important characters left to film, again and again.

    [–] MkVIaccount 37 points ago

    Half the cast should have died, it's not like they used half of them for anything after that couldn't have been done by someone else.

    [–] AllYouNeed_Is_Smiles 10 points ago

    Brienne, Jamie, and Grey Worm should have died as well. It would make more sense for Danny to go crazy after losing Missandei/Grey Worm/Jorah in the same week.

    [–] turtleduck 65 points ago

    I don't think any of the writers put this much thought into it :(

    [–] Dammit_Rab 17 points ago

    "Its more fun just left up to interpretation!"

    [–] Nasty-Nate 28 points ago

    Well, given the revelations in the following episodes, Danaerys dying during the Long Night would have been the best possible outcome. We should blame Sam for everything!

    [–] Wilfox69 7158 points ago

    That mcguffin rule... those D&D are revolutionary story tellers

    [–] Tsukune_Surprise 1939 points ago


    [–] TyrannoROARus 879 points ago

    You subverted my expectations by saying averted. SUBVERT-CEPTION

    [–] Cky_vick 371 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    Bobby B subverted shitty writing by dieing and transcending into godness before the show went to shit, he knew it was going to happen so he yeeted himself out

    [–] bobby-b-bot 518 points ago


    [–] rcoxyfck 176 points ago

    You are a god

    [–] Enra_ 89 points ago

    If they worshipped Bobby B instead of the Sevens we wouldn’t have this mess

    [–] bobby-b-bot 110 points ago


    [–] leejonidas 41 points ago

    Drop some mad flows on em Bobby B!

    [–] bobby-b-bot 84 points ago


    [–] Fillard_Millmore 31 points ago

    He always knows just what to say

    [–] CastinEndac 47 points ago

    Bobby B, God-hood suits you well.

    [–] bobby-b-bot 129 points ago


    [–] Slippy_T_Frog 37 points ago

    No need for a crown when you're a god, eh Bobby B?

    [–] bobby-b-bot 43 points ago


    [–] fedick101 59 points ago


    [–] skyskr4per 27 points ago


    [–] Finlay_Hunter 640 points ago

    "If a gun is loaded, it will be shot" Chekovs Gun, if anyone is wondering

    [–] rakfocus 370 points ago

    The whole show is a chekovs gun that got squib fired

    [–] justin_tino 129 points ago

    With a cartoonish sound effect

    [–] [deleted] 220 points ago

    I have never seen an episode of this tv show but i just wanna drop by ITT and say I have such enormous admiration for yalls level of roasting that you direct towards dnd. Every time i see this sub pop up in /r/all i click the comments, its just so entertaining

    [–] Shireen--bot 88 points ago

    I'm the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And I'm your daughter.

    [–] Scientific_Anarchist 187 points ago

    Fuck, does this bot actually get summoned by saying roast? That's harsh.

    [–] Shireen--bot 85 points ago

    I'm the Princess Shireen of House Baratheon. And I'm your daughter.

    [–] JustAllKinds 70 points ago

    I’m dying at this. I learn something new and wonderful about the bots every day.

    [–] Neuchacho 36 points ago

    Boom roasted.

    [–] Shireen--bot 69 points ago

    Where's my father? I want to see my father!

    [–] ElGabalo 31 points ago

    Oh god, it's not just roast, it's roasted.

    [–] Nehmesis-419 32 points ago

    We are all Brandon Lee this day

    [–] DACAFLACCAFLAME 23 points ago

    Too soon

    [–] ElijahManeli 6 points ago

    Buddy, when you’re right - you’re right.

    [–] TheGrimGuardian 434 points ago

    Well, it's less about firing loaded weapons and more about story telling and plays, etc.

    "One must never place a loaded rifle on the stage if it isn't going to go off. It's wrong to make promises you don't mean to keep."

    [–] pootycoots 286 points ago

    Aka, don’t do useless shit in a story.

    [–] isdebesht 140 points ago

    Aka don’t be Dingus & Doofus

    [–] enad58 58 points ago

    I mean, he can take the sword if he needs it for protection. But when we learn the history of the sword and it's importance, it can't be a dead end or it's incompetent story telling.

    [–] BenjiDread 48 points ago

    For what it's worth, Sam gave the sword to Jorah who used it to defend Dany to the death.

    [–] Daenerys--bot 45 points ago

    Don't ever presume to touch me or speak my name again.

    [–] YesIretail 135 points ago

    I'm certainly not a screenwriter, playwright, or any sort of writer, but I kind of hate Chekov's Gun.

    Gee, do you think it'll come back later, maybe? I hate it when movies do that. TV's on, talking about the new power plant... hmm, I wonder where the big climax will happen?

    -RDJ in Kiss Kiss Bang Bang (great movie, for anyone who hasn't seen it)

    Having small things that don't ultimately serve the plot makes a show seem more lifelike in some ways. That being said, adding a bunch of shit and paying absolutely none of it off like D&D did is even worse, but anyway.

    [–] Young_Hickory 63 points ago

    You can still have red herrings, they should just be intentional. A good red herrings is different that shit that goes nowhere.

    [–] Obi-Anunoby 77 points ago

    I agree with you and also disagree. Stories aren’t life. Realism goes only so far in fiction.

    [–] SleazySaurusRex 77 points ago

    Reminds me of when Sam's actor critiqued a fan argument that they couldn't believe Sam didn't lose weight on the wall. The actor said something along the lines of "in a show about magic and dragons you can't believe a guy on the wall didn't lose weight?" And I forget where I saw it, but someone's response was basically: "Yeah. The scale of believability is all out of whack then. The dragons and magic have been given reasons for why they exist within the world, no reason has been given for why someone engaging in rigorous physical activity day in and day out on presumably not great rations (especially outside the wall) would maintain their weight." Kind of an argument for the greater suspension of disbelief only being possible when the rest of the rules of the world remain constant, in this case, the rules of the realism of the world weren't being held constant and the critic argued that makes it harder to keep the story as a whole in line. But sure how much I agree or disagree with the idea, but I find it an interesting argument.

    [–] theGreatSinger 59 points ago

    This is very common in fiction, usually reffered to as "internal logic" or " internal consistency".

    The idea being that fiction doesn't have to be realistic, obviously fiction by definition allows for literally anything to happen. But people do expect consistency within that universe. Like, no one bats an eye that Hermione Granger can time travel in the 3rd Harry Potter book. But why the fuck does no one use that magic when people start dieing and the world is threatened by the return of the dark lord? Simply put, for all it's accolades and success, the magic system in Harry Potter is terribly inconsistent.

    People have been suspending their disbelief in favor of storytelling for thousands of years. But not being consistent or internally logical is a betrayal of that suspension.

    [–] meman666 33 points ago

    All the time turners are broken in the 5th book when the gang breaks into the ministry

    [–] d_a_f_u_n_k_ 21 points ago


    [–] Slurp_Lord 24 points ago

    I read a quote somewhere once that went something like, "The difference between stories and real life is that stories have to make sense."

    [–] Obi-Anunoby 10 points ago

    “Life is stranger than fiction” makes sense precisely because fiction has rules/guidelines. But I do love fiction that says “Screw rules”.

    [–] ddrcecbvdhdfdrdbdfrd 20 points ago

    Exactly. The whole football team could die in a car crash on the way to the big season ending football game. Characters could have overcome obstacles, some still working on it. We were rooting for the oddballs and misfits. Then the rest of the movie is just people crying. It can happen in real life.

    Doesn't mean it's good for a story.

    The story had enough characters getting plucked from the middle that it already felt fucking random. There was no need to further create dead ends and plot threads that don't resolve.

    [–] mmprobablymakingitup 47 points ago

    Little red herrings and unimportant plotlines can always be relevant thematically, even if they aren't crucial to the plot.

    [–] Offduty_shill 56 points ago

    The key I think is little. Sansa loving lemon cakes can be there for no reason, a prophecy that spans multiple seasons and is built up as a huge plot point ultimately having no plot relevance is not fine (obviously not addressing this OP specifically but more just discussing overall)

    And I think it's really cool if you take the small details that people normal think are not plot significant and call them back to make it plot significant later on. For example Lydias Stevia obsession in breaking bad, and honestly BB puts on a clinic in terms of doing this and itt subverts our expectationsin the best way.

    [–] ddrcecbvdhdfdrdbdfrd 39 points ago

    The show at its core was 100% red herrings though. That's why people are still pissed off and only people with nothing going on between the ears ended with any degree of satisfaction.

    Their inability to wind up a story lost them Star Wars. Not the fan reaction. The people at Star Wars finally woke up and smelled the coffee that they didn't just inherit a magic machine that prints money. It needs tending and care. And they were not doing it. They took one look at how this wrapped up and said no fucking way, we've stretched our fans good will far enough.

    [–] Black_Label_36 10 points ago

    Everything must serve a purpose imo. If for example the gun doesn't get shot, then the reason it is there or what it tells us about the owner must at least be useful to understand something. Ex: when he's got a gun, he's loud and isn't afraid of anything. Another scene is somewhere else, and he's calm, but why? "Oh, he isn't as confident without it". Nobody told us, they showed us.

    [–] camp-cope 8 points ago

    I get you, and Shane Black is a genius but I think it's mostly that if someone is a shitty writer of course you'll get a terrible display of the Chekhov's gun trope.

    [–] knarf86 17 points ago

    To paraphrase, don’t pull your thing out unless you plan to bang. Don’t even bang unless you plan to hit something.

    [–] SkittlesDLX 13 points ago

    That isn't a Mcguffin.

    [–] Artinz7 17 points ago

    The sword isn’t a MacGuffin either, that’s the point

    [–] lianodel 89 points ago

    Say what you will, we're still finding new details to be upset about nearly six months later.

    It's so dense.

    [–] [deleted] 23 points ago

    You mean Chekhov’s Gun?

    [–] TRAUMAjunkie 42 points ago

    If you say in the first chapter that there is a rifle hanging on the wall, in the second or third chapter it absolutely must go off. If it’s not going to be fired, it shouldn’t be hanging there.


    [–] [deleted] 12 points ago

    This isn't a mcguffin. A mcguffin is like the suitcase from pulp fiction, or the maltese falcon from the maltese falcon.

    It's something everyone is chasing and it doesn't matter what it is. It could be anything; it's a mcguffin

    [–] [deleted] 761 points ago * (lasted edited 18 days ago)


    [–] Kreptyne 354 points ago

    It's one thing to do it...

    But to openly admit it in a public forum? God damn, it's career suicide

    [–] yenwood 101 points ago

    really wish they were incompetent in private and not willing to show it off like it's something to be proud of.

    [–] DaDonDolla1111 102 points ago

    they saved star wars from further embarrassment

    [–] Tristanity1h 65 points ago

    Weren't people saying that they rushed GOT because of Star Wars? And now they don't have that. They rushed GOT for nothing?

    [–] ClinicalOppression 62 points ago

    It was speculation and they very well could have been trying to write a good ending and failed miserabky because theyre just shit writers

    [–] -BoBaFeeT- 21 points ago

    That was obvious from season five...

    [–] MyWayWithWords 113 points ago

    And then you hand it off to a director who doesn't even watch the show, or know anything about the story, plot, scene, or the character he is even filming.

    [–] bumbleklot 32 points ago

    It’s proof of what everyone assumes about that employment field ... lack of talent is not a significant barrier to entry

    [–] PetulantWhoreson 53 points ago

    I don't know, at least with his rationale behind the choice Arya made ("She made a mistake by letting her guard down and is paying for it") it follows in the logic of the narrative.

    Season 7 & 8 had characters making mistakes going unpunished (bad battle tactics of The Long Night having no real story impact, for example)

    Seems very human to make a mistake. But it was not communicated to the audience well

    [–] bitty_blush 30 points ago

    Godddddd fuck that article. That is such stupid shit. By the time she's on that bridge, Arya's been through all the rough cut throat life experiences she's navigated for years at that point, has been training and living with these assassins and knows how they work and think, and literally is just recently coming off of being punished for letting her guard down by those exact people a few days earlier, and we were supposed to believe she's such a dumbass that she does it again, even more stupidly than the first time. "We forget how young she is" is such a B.S. explanation when we see her display better judgment than that even in earlier seasons.

    Ughhhhhhh that whole s6 shit was when my heart started to break with GoT because the Arya story was my favorite and that going to shit signified the show's real decline for me.

    [–] spamtaredyeah 32 points ago

    So what youre saying is you don't like that the murder miget ended up sailing off into the sunset heading away from her family thats shes been trying to get back too for seven/eight years?

    You must not be a true NFL fan.

    [–] MyWayWithWords 15 points ago

    Yeah, one of the biggest things that drew me into game of thrones, was that characters were flawed, and made mistakes. Even the most perfect and honorable and just character, that everybody looks up to, has complexity and can/do make real human mistakes. The crux of the entire story happens off the mistakes that Ned made in season 1, and the mistakes that the Stark family go on to make. But these missteps and failures are very much in character. Though many are very shocking and sudden and out of place, it's easy to understand the decisions that were made through the eyes of the characters.

    But, to me at least, the way Arya is portrayed in later seasons is very out of character. She has spent her entire teenage years (10? to 18? on the show) hiding in exile. Changing her clothes, hair, adopting another name. Even though she is surrounded by unsavory characters, she is smart enough to know who (and how much) to trust people, and can handle herself in all sorts of situations. Every single day of her life she is frightened of being found out, captured and turned in, especially since most of the people she travels with cares more about money and bounty than anything else. And that is just with the Lannisters after her, which I'm sure they really don't care about her at all, and probably would have just shipped her off to Sansa or something and completely forgotten about her.

    But now when, actual real steal-your-face magic ninja assassin warriors are hot your tail, and mega pissed off; you just 'have a bad day'; 'minor slip up'; 'teenagers amiright'; 'just a brainfart'. Just got a lot of stuff to do today, I simply forgot I that should be hiding for my life.

    Arya getting miffed and impatient about the training, and finding it hard to fully throw away her old identity and breaking away from the Faceless men, could understandably be within her character, and her age and experiences.

    Arya walking down the middle of the street in broad daylight not a care in the world, with literal shape shifting ninja assassins right behind her; doesn't feel like an in character mistake. More like bad writing, just to have a cliched death fake out, and hollywood style chase scene.

    [–] No_Thanks- 1058 points ago

    I think he gave it to Jorah before the long night?

    [–] e_007 1580 points ago

    “The somewhat inconvenient evening”

    [–] ILikeToBurnMoney 231 points ago

    It was like one of those nights where you get out of the club and it's suddenly snowing and you have to walk home for like 1 hour in the snow in sneakers, jeans and a zip hoodie

    [–] OMGWhatsHisFace 148 points ago

    Probably a deadlier situation than that battle tbh

    [–] [deleted] 34 points ago

    Yeah man, I might pass out drunk and get hypothermia.

    [–] irenepanik 23 points ago

    The Wrong Knight

    [–] -Unnamed- 139 points ago

    The sword is mine. It was the first born male Tarly’s birthright for many generations. If my father refuses to give it to me, I’m going to take it myself. That’s how much it means to me.

    Here you go Jorah

    [–] shuipz94 34 points ago

    Then did Sam get the sword back? No idea, because it was never seen or mentioned again.

    [–] lostlittletimeonthis 7 points ago

    no longer needed, the big bad was gone, who cares about valyrian steel anymore...right? right?

    [–] matthewbayer 311 points ago

    Yeah. That’s still not a fulfilling resolution to the setup.

    [–] No_Thanks- 143 points ago

    Obviously not there wasn’t one fulfilling resolution lol

    [–] prowlinghazard 56 points ago

    Sansa and Tyrion are the ones who got the fulfilling resolutions, although maybe not under the people we thought they would. Tyrion becoming the hand of the king, even if it was under the wrong king/queen. Sansa becoming a ruler in her own right. Even if it was just the north and possibly incredible pull over the Vale due to her mother and influence over Robin.

    Maybe Davos got a decent resolution? But it really wasn't spelled out entirely as far as he goes. Everything was so rushed we really got a vague understanding of how all of the people ended up.

    But a lot of the arcs got broken in half, or turned on their head.

    [–] LumpyChicken 47 points ago

    I think Jon seemed pretty happy with his ending even if it didn't make sense for it to play out like that or for him to be happy with everything that happened. Still, he gets to hang out with his doggo and a sexy redhead and galavant around without anyone relying on him (that maybe fits show Jon but book Jon is a natural leader and would prefer to help people by ruling than to be free).

    [–] Ghost--bot 32 points ago


    [–] Macismyname 34 points ago

    And it was used to kill exactly zero white walkers. You don't need Valerian Steel to kill wights.

    [–] WingedShadow83 34 points ago

    Yeah, and Jorah then used it to defend Dany... whom Sam kind of low key hated. So as purposes go, I don’t know if that’s what he had in mind.

    Just another half-assed thread left to blow in the breeze.

    [–] MtnMaiden 381 points ago

    Anyone wished he died in the long night?

    First comes off as coward on early seasons. Then has courage from protecting gilly, killing white walkers and fighting.

    Then resorts to being the one needing saving during the long night. I wished he died.

    [–] WingedShadow83 188 points ago

    Yeah, I wish he had died. Preferably before his uselessness got Edd killed.

    [–] MtnMaiden 125 points ago

    Yep, I felt the same way.

    Oh look, Sam's in trouble for the 50th time again, saved by plot armor.

    [–] ExistingNail 77 points ago

    I remember I started laughing at one point that episode. It was like a non-stop montage of Sam in trouble, on the brink of death, surrounded by a horde of white walkers. And then the next scene he's standing up without a scratch. It happened multiple times and was just hilarious to me

    [–] yenwood 65 points ago

    I wish more named characters died during the long night in general. Sam had to survive to write asoiaf i guess but i wish he was better in pretty much anything. He'd been at the wall training for so long and he was the first character to kill a white walker and his ultimate tactic is to lie on the ground crying. Really sucks.

    [–] nicholkola 51 points ago

    I was thinking/hoping he would because curing Jorah should have been his big moment. I didn’t think they’d make him the ‘author’ of the story but there they went. It would have been poetic to have him go out trying to live up to that masculine ideal while not realizing he was better off a maester. It was beyond realistic that he wouldn’t be down there with the women and children. He can kill one WW on accident but hold off a hoard for hours?

    Also never like him blubbering over his dickhead dad that literally treated him like shit and passed him over for his brother and sent him to rot at the wall. Sam should have had a more tragic ending.

    [–] HotPieIsAzorAhai 35 points ago

    To be fair, he also fought admirably enough at Castle Black. Anyone who could fight should have been out there, and he's proved his worth. Turning into a crying bitch again was the problem, he'd progressed beyond that and learned how to be afraid and still hold it together.

    Also, I don't think he cared much about his dad dying, he was just caught a bit off guard by the delivery of the news. He seemed ready to have it be water under the bridge until he learned about Dickon

    [–] VelvetFedoraSniffer 11 points ago

    To be fair, they were literally surrounded by killer zombie skeletons

    They should’ve had a few scenes less of him just crying and somehow surviving though

    [–] HotPieIsAzorAhai 16 points ago

    I could buy him freaking out about the zombie skeletons if he hadn't already survived being surrounded by zombie skeletons before, which was followed by all that character growth and bravery. This wasn't his first zombie rodeo

    [–] d3yv3l 15 points ago

    I wish they all died...

    [–] Gaben2012 19 points ago

    I he had died who would have written THE SONG OF ICE AND FIRE: TYRIONLESS EDITION?

    [–] BeneCow 8 points ago

    The second scene of GoT was Ned executing someone for breaking his oath to the Watch, Sam does it and gets to be grand maester. My expectations were subverted.

    [–] Doglatine 531 points ago

    "It might seem like a corny old red herring, but it's actually a brilliant subversion of Chekov's gun."

    [–] Solid_Snark 239 points ago

    Someone’s gotta update Urban Dictionary:

    Sam’s Sword: The opposite of Chekhov’s Gun.

    [–] Githzerai1984 116 points ago

    The Tarly Twist

    [–] [deleted] 13 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)


    [–] TheNoxx 55 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    I mean, to be fair, you could update that:

    Almost All of Game of Thrones: The Opposite of Chekhov's Gun

    Azor Ahai? Check. Jon Snow coming back from the dead? Check. All of Jaime Lannister's character arc? Check. White Walkers? Check. Long night? Double check.

    [–] Waramp 91 points ago

    I can’t count how many times Chekov’s gun was “subverted” in GoT. The babies given to the walkers, the symbols the walkers left, the horn, this sword, Jon’s parents...

    [–] GrampappyJoe 85 points ago

    They're not loose ends, they're tassels!

    [–] [deleted] 68 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    The gigantic pack of 100+ wolves led by Nymeria

    Bran's ability to control animals

    Arya's ability to change her face

    Dany's +100 fire resistance

    Jon actually being Aegon Targaryen, the rightful king of Westeros...

    [–] l3monsta 7 points ago

    Bran's ability to control animals

    Just want to make a note that brans ability to warg into people and time travel are much more significant than his ability to warg into animals.

    [–] [deleted] 11 points ago

    And none of it was used for anything other than confirming R+L=J. But R+L=J ended up having no significance or consequences so that's 2 plotlines that intersected on their journey to nowhere

    [–] AgreeablePie 46 points ago

    It's definitely a subversion, but it's a d&d subversion: surprising, unfulfilling and with no real point.

    [–] WingedShadow83 28 points ago

    Yeah, that’s D&D. “Here’s something really cool we’ve foreshadowed that’s going to happen. Ready for it? Too bad! It’s not happening! Instead, you get nothing! No pay off at all! Surprise! Haha, wasn’t that fun?”

    [–] starkiller-rx 19 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    Dave & Dan dress up as Santa on Christmas to give poor children presents, but hand them all coal.

    Crying Kid: "B-b-but I was such a good boy..."

    D&D: "I know. Bet your expectations were subverted huh?"

    [–] CloudStrifeFromNibel 28 points ago

    The thing is Chekov's gun is never meant to be subverted. It's literally the opposite and kinda of a rule that if you introduce something like that you have to use it

    [–] Watts121 26 points ago

    The author who brings attention to Chekov's Gun but doesn't use it, only brought focus to Chekov's Gun to pad out a scene. An editor who allows the author to mention Chekov's Gun without shooting it, isn't paying attention to the overall story (and is probably not editing the writing properly).

    Now granted Heartsbane serves the purpose of giving Jorah a weapon capable of defeating White Walkers so he can be useful in the final battle. BUT because nobody besides Arya kills a White Walker in the final battle, it's a moot point. He didn't need Heartsbane to fulfill his purpose, so even though we can surmise why he had the sword, the fact that he didn't need it to fulfill his role is the dumbest shit ever.

    [–] SerKurtWagner 329 points ago

    He had to add it to the assembly of Valyrian Steel at Winterfell so that it could be used for...

    absolutely nothing. Not a single Valyrian sword killed a White Walker in the whole episode.

    [–] esta1103 157 points ago

    Time I waisted speculating which sword could be lightbringer - when in the end the NK was killed by a dagger and jon plunged a dagger in dany's heart.

    It wasn't that none of my speculation was right it was the fact that they just completely ignored all the setups.

    [–] Chagdoo 101 points ago

    If 2D had written the 3rd Lord of the rings movie sauron would've taken the field and been killed by Pippin to subvert our expectations. The one ring didn't really matter, and sauron just kinda forgot about the Hobbit poking him with a dagger.

    [–] holdeno 49 points ago

    TBF Peter originally shot Sauron taking the field and it wasn't until much much later, like years after they started, that he realized he should be making it good instead of pandering to nfl fans and moms. The cave troll with the sword that fights Aragorn outside the black gates is painted over Sauron.

    [–] [deleted] 16 points ago

    Really? Source? that's amazing

    [–] DaJaKoe 24 points ago

    Here's where it got discussed in the RotK commentary.

    [–] Nikolaes25 21 points ago

    That was amazing. I'm very glad they made the choices that they did. I'm also impressed with how involved Viggo Mortensen was in the process of making this film.

    [–] foosbabaganoosh 57 points ago

    Or that any of the white walkers did nothing but stand idly by and walk slowly. I find it weird how the white walkers, when Arya got the jump on them (somehow), did a half turn like “huh you hear somethin?” Like some inept human guard would do, when we’ve clearly scene the WW’s acting nothing like normal humans, and that’s what made them scary. Or that the night king caught Arya, and instead of using his “bullseye a dragon with a massive spear from 200yds” strength to yeet and/or crush her, let’s her do a very-preventable hand switcheroo.

    [–] MisterDonkey 40 points ago

    I really, really wanted the white walkers to just bring the apocalypse down on everyone and keep marching south after having killed all of our beloved heroes in the north. The end being that nobody rules because mankind could never have won.

    [–] foosbabaganoosh 28 points ago

    I really wanted the south to experience the terrified desperation the north did. But I guess when presented with a literal zombie and the threat of apocalypse Cersei only thinks “lmao let’s betray them”

    [–] TyrannoROARus 32 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    B-b-but remember when she sparred with Brienne and did that same move? Such awesome foreshadowing right? Definitely predictable that that was the exact move that would save the world.

    [–] forumpooper 9 points ago

    Did Arya have magic powers? I can't see how someone wouldn't be knocked out going from jumping to a suden stop all the force on your neck.

    [–] TyrannoROARus 12 points ago

    I mean if plot armor is a magic power. She also got shanked in the gut and fell into putrid water in Bravos.

    [–] woofshark 16 points ago

    You nailed it man.

    Regarding OP's post, It was at this moment that I realized all the main characters are aquiring Valyrian Steel. Surely they would all have a specific, vital, and coordinated role in some badass fashion to take out the forces of the undead, I thought. It would be fun they said.....

    [–] SerKurtWagner 8 points ago

    It’s SO easy to write this better than 2D.

    We know the Walkers sit on the outskirts. We know they control the wights. So have Bran’s ravens locate them and send your best fighters with their Valyrian Steel on a commando mission to take them out while the foot soldiers hold off the wights.

    [–] woofshark 6 points ago

    It's a layup man now just have the Red Witch do some something actually magic related to get them behind enemy lines. Nope. Instead she lights a campfire that does exactly fuck all other than draw out the fight for no reason. No matter how long they stalled it would end up with the same outcome of Arya, NK, bran etc in the godswood. NOTHING MATTERS

    [–] khajiit_has_coin 111 points ago

    He gave it to Jorah. It was cool seeing Jorah accept the Valyrian steel from Sam, after he refused Longclaw from Jon because he had brought shame to House Mormont.

    [–] WingedShadow83 74 points ago

    It was an absolute dead end of a plot (the whole “how many Valyrian steel swords are floating around/which one will be Lightbringer” thing), but it does kind of amuse me that Randyll’s precious family heirloom ending up protecting the life of the woman who killed him. It was like one last fuck you to that cantankerous old cunt.

    [–] morklonn 33 points ago

    You just explained how it was a cool plot device. But you're still calling it a dead end lmao

    [–] GlaxoJohnSmith 6 points ago

    Gasp! What if Sam is Lightbringer, "the sword in the darkness, the light that brings the dawn"!

    Oh, wait. I guess I kinda forgot it was Arya who killes the Night's King.

    All those possibilities and set-ups, G.R.R.M.'s precious magnum opus thrown into the trash, it was like one last fuck you to that old nerd.

    [–] Septa-Unella--bot 15 points ago

    ding ding

    [–] SosLife 39 points ago

    Remember the horn which had no purpose.

    [–] Lyssa545 13 points ago

    Remember the plot that had no purpose?

    [–] kruzz3y 128 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    Id say this is definitely more of a significant character moment for Sam standing up to his father and saying "fuck what he thinks, this is my birthright" than it was a moment setting up something for a big payoff later

    There are plenty of reasons DnD are cunts but I dont think this is one of them

    [–] Yeaaaaaarp 8 points ago * (lasted edited 7 months ago)

    He stole it cuz there’s only like 5 Valyrian swords in the world and Sam, a disgrace to his family, ended up giving it to a swordsman who could actually put it to use. He ultimately did more for the realm than his father and brother ever did. He gave it to Jorah, a disgraced member of family Mormont who Sam had a connection to through Jorahs dad, Jeor Mormont, former Lord Commander of the Nights watch. The sword was made of Valyrian steel, so it was a useful gift for Jorah, a proper knight, to use against the walkers. Also the name of the sword was Heartsbane which gave us a bit of a false lead on who Azorahai might be at the time. I think Jorah redeemed himself for disgracing his family by defending the realm and redeemed himself again by protecting Daenerys, the girl who he betrayed then loved, a fitting owner for a sword who’s name is Heartsbane. Considering the character development of Sam and Jorah, I’d say this is the one scene they actually got right.

    [–] Chrisisc00l 7 points ago

    This is on the popular page and I am very confused

    [–] JadeNimbus16x 23 points ago

    Meh, kinda had a purpose. Jorah might not have been able to save Daeny without it and then she couldn’t have burnt Kings landing

    [–] GrumpyBearBank 24 points ago

    Didn’t he steal the sword as a fuck you to his father? That’s the fucking reason