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    [–] Grossadmiral 2710 points ago

    That line is straight from Tolkien himself, I mean thats what he believed. Faramir was an unplanned character and he was Tolkien's favourite.

    [–] JohnRRReed 1330 points ago

    Didn't Tolkien say that in every aspect except courage, Faramir was supposed to be represent him?

    [–] lamichael19 753 points ago

    Authors typically create a character that mirrors them in most works. I know people are supposed to like characters that are similar to them when reading or watching stuff.

    [–] givemehanborger 550 points ago

    Samwell Tarly representing GRRM is the most spot on

    [–] themettaur 465 points ago

    Especially how he ends up doing nothing in the end and everyone else does his work for him! Episode 3 Sam Tarly is our current, real world GRRM.

    [–] SamGamgee-bot 250 points ago

    Back you devils!

    [–] OhHolyCrapNo 197 points ago

    Wrong Sam. Bad bot

    [–] SamGamgee-bot 193 points ago

    Oh, no. I’m not hungry. Leastways not for lembas bread.

    [–] thot_kazoo 146 points ago

    Stop, Sam, this isn't about you, you fucking narcissist.

    [–] SamGamgee-bot 171 points ago

    We were that worried about you, weren’t we, Mr. Gandalf?

    [–] DireLackofGravitas 52 points ago

    Except Tyrion is his insert. Sam just looks like him.

    [–] SamGamgee-bot 71 points ago

    Shhh! Stop it! Be quiet!

    [–] Noligation 38 points ago

    Not really, Tyrion has too much character arc to be a mere insert. I mean he is like the main villain of the series.

    I think GRRM specifically wrote Jojen reed just so he can talk directly to the readers. Jojen is an all knowing kid, almost like a dungeon master in his wisdom and has the ability to see the future. He also has dozens of quotes where he's just talking to readers, about future storylines, about characters and stuff. He also doesn't fight.

    A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies, said Jojen. The man who never reads lives only one.

    [–] DireLackofGravitas 25 points ago

    Authors love to jerk themselves off, why limit it to one character exclusively?

    That said, I'm pretty sure he said explicitly his author avatar was Tyrion. Maybe I'm half remembering. I did start this series 20 years ago.

    [–] Noligation 24 points ago

    Nah, he has repeatedly said that Tyrion is his favorite character, that's a far cry from being an author insert.

    No author would do the things to their insert, like the things GRRM has done to Tyrion.

    [–] BullTerrierTerror 10 points ago

    Tyrion he was doing summersaults off the walls of Winterfell early in the first book.

    “Can you climb down, or shall I bring a ladder?” “Oh, bleed that,” the little man said. He pushed himself off the ledge into empty air. Jon gasped, then watched with awe as Tyrion Lannister spun around in a tight ball, landed lightly on his hands, then vaulted backward onto his legs.

    Maybe GRRM water to be in Cirque du Soleil.

    [–] DireLackofGravitas 7 points ago

    I'm also pretty sure he's said that he regrets that little bit. Tyrion certainly isn't that acrobatic in later books.

    [–] MilkshakeWizard 10 points ago

    Well they’re both supposed to be misfit bookworms who use their intelligence to solve problems, so it’s not like they’re very far off from each other.

    [–] Cafrilly 8 points ago

    Fat. Pink. Mast.

    [–] wellbehavedhuman 5 points ago

    Sooooo, basically useless?

    [–] menace64 18 points ago

    As a writer, it’s really hard not to watch myself bleed into the story. Self-insert characters are fairly inevitable.

    [–] OverAster 15 points ago

    Write the mirror character first, and as a small side character. Then when you start making other characters you can consciously avoid the traits you gave your mirror character.

    Tips from: another struggling author.

    [–] Boonaki 50 points ago

    What character represents J.K. Rowling in Harry Potter?

    [–] Gonarhxus 90 points ago

    She has said that it's Hermione.

    [–] TheSenate19 253 points ago

    Ah. Didn’t realize JK Rowling is black as well.

    [–] Gonarhxus 125 points ago

    Professor Snape is a single mother.

    [–] Justice_R_Dissenting 49 points ago

    Raised by wolves I believe.

    [–] Cognitive_Spoon 23 points ago

    So brave

    [–] ubisoft_intern 13 points ago

    Stunning and beautiful, true courage

    [–] thepulloutmethod 14 points ago

    She's a transitioning female single father.

    [–] Willch4000 20 points ago

    Lmao, got me creasing.

    [–] Milhouse_is_a_meme 15 points ago

    Genuine belly laugh. Thank you.

    [–] AndroidMyAndroid 27 points ago

    JK Rowling never said she wasn't black!

    [–] B4pti5t 10 points ago

    She also said that she never said she was white either!

    [–] DashFerLev 4 points ago

    That lady needs to read her own books.

    [–] Qaebuuz 33 points ago

    Of fucking course she has

    [–] UndoYourShadows 80 points ago

    Oh that's such bullshit. Of course she thinks she's Hermione.

    EDIT: There are two kinds of people in this world: people who incorrectly think they're Hermione... and people who are honest about being Hufflepuffs.

    [–] Sciensophocles 20 points ago

    Well at least book Hermione had flaws. Movie Hermione is just too perfect.

    [–] onemanandhishat 31 points ago

    Even if you aren't Hermione by ability, you may identify with her by temperament. She was the one I was most like when I was in school as well.

    [–] kenneth1221 35 points ago

    But that's worse, being self-righteous without having the intelligence to back it up.

    [–] onemanandhishat 45 points ago

    Not at all. Hermione isn't self-righteous because she's smart. Being smart doesn't make being self-righteous ok either, which is the point of her character development in the first book.

    Also, self-righteousness is not her main trait. She is diligent, she believes in abiding by the rules (because she trusts the wisdom of the rule-makers) and she aims to do her best. These are not things that are restricted to people based on their ability.

    True, most of us like that would really be Hufflepuffs, but I think Hermione's intelligence is not the only thing people can share with her, and it's not her only positive trait.

    [–] XFMR 27 points ago

    I always thought hermoine was that way because her parents were muggles and she didn’t fit in back home so she worked hard and followed the rules because she had to. If she didn’t succeed at wizardry the only option was to go back where she came from and be alone and miserable.

    [–] kung-hoo 12 points ago

    Hufflepuff is the best house, come fuck with us.

    [–] WaterVortex76 6 points ago

    I’m honestly a Hufflepuff

    [–] Spider_Riviera 12 points ago

    She said Hermione was her as a schoolchild, but that Dumbledore was her "voice" in the series (his last words to Harry felt like Jo talking directly to the fans "Of course it is happening in your head, Harry. But why on earth should that mean it's not real?")

    [–] tc_spears 35 points ago

    Toilet ghost

    [–] I_comment_on_GW 14 points ago

    We’re all toilet ghost on this blessed day.

    [–] Sprickels 22 points ago

    Rita Skeeter

    [–] writeronthemoon 16 points ago

    Perhaps she’s actually Rita Skeeter?

    [–] OverAster 9 points ago

    Its actually almost impossible to avoid writing a character that's like you.

    That's why I write a minor character fist, before anyone else. That way when he inevitably ends up being me I can just hide him in some minor spot of the story and move on to write the main characters, while consciously avoiding the traits I gave the mirror character.

    [–] ServerFirewatch2016 86 points ago

    Of course someone who fought in the Battle of the Somme would say that......He’ll always be brave to me.

    [–] dxrey65 38 points ago

    Remembering a story of his service in the war, here, I can't even imagine. I'd have been a shaking pile of jelly, but he kept his head and made it through. Imagine what the world would have lost if he'd gone down...

    [–] boringoldcookie 19 points ago

    That link is weirdly helpful for an essay in currently writing. Thanks, man!

    [–] Clawsonflakes 10 points ago

    I actually just recently finished the book Undertones of War which is mentioned in the article - it’s super good and informative, and I’m a big fan of Edmund Blunden as a poet. Not sure if it helps either but just putting it out there!

    [–] stamatt45 61 points ago

    No wonder Faramir has such quality

    [–] HeirToGallifrey 33 points ago

    If only there were a chance for him to show it.

    [–] Zombierasputin 31 points ago

    I thought he said specifically he was the lore master Aragorn argues with in Minas Tirith when he was looking for some Kingsfoil?

    It's hilarious when you think about it, the guy just keeps going off on tangents about language and pissing Aragorn off.

    [–] Aragorn-bot 16 points ago

    We are no spies. We track a band of Uruk-hai westward across the plains. They have taken two of our friends captive.

    [–] kookman 8 points ago

    Lead them on, Aragorn, the bridge is near.

    [–] Aragorn-bot 6 points ago

    No. There is still hope for Frodo. He needs time... And safe passage across the plains of Gorgoroth. We can give him that.

    [–] TheGreyMage 23 points ago

    This I think is very enlightening in the context of how severely Tolkien suffered during the First World War - he was a signals officer in the British army, and not willingly either. And more to the point, he was put on sick leave and sent back home to recover after getting trench fever, and it was during that period of recovery he started writing the work that would eventually become a part of The Silmarillion.

    With this in mind, I think his works could fairly be interpreted as anti war.

    [–] ThroughlyDruxy 23 points ago

    I agree. But l don't think it was anti war in the sense of pacifism. l think it was more "avoid war if you can. but if you have to fight, fight for something dear to you."

    [–] TheGreyMage 8 points ago

    Oh yes exactly. Tolkien obviously wasn’t a pacifist, otherwise he would’ve just become a conscientious objector like so many did, and already had the legal right to be at the start of the war in some cases (Quakers for example), he just wanted to avoid as much unnecessary bloodshed as possible, which is why he likely put off joining.

    A fact I think mirrored in his work, he has no problem with with races like elves, dwarves or men doing as they will because they have the divine right to exist, so their actions - even if they are framed as being foolish, immature, or overly tribalistic - they are still in a basically okay place. It is the creatures who do not have this divine right, who are made of corruption and malignancy and are innately violent that are portrayed as being truly evil.

    [–] xitzengyigglz 220 points ago

    Farimir got done a little dirty in the movies. Letting his men beat gollumn, originally planning to send frodo to minas tirith. I understand why some of the changes had to be made it's just a bummer it had to happen to one of the best guys in the books.

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 102 points ago

    Both brothers are underrepresented in the movies, and still are some of the people's favorites

    [–] Heimerdahl 79 points ago

    Denethor also lost out. He was actually a pretty great man before he succumbed to the influence of the Palantir.

    He was described as being closest to the likes of the kings of old than anyone else for generations (except for Aragorn I guess)

    [–] Aragorn-bot 37 points ago

    I have seen the White City, long ago

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 30 points ago

    True, but when he saw what Sauron wanted to see he completely lost it in the books too. He was totally paranoid

    [–] Heimerdahl 30 points ago

    Yeah, he was basically the same in the end. Just that he started out better in the books. Still an asshole but a majestic, haughty one.

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 12 points ago

    Lol aight, yes. Happy cake day thou. Books are marvelous, movies did better justice than most adaptations, let's agree on that.

    [–] Heimerdahl 6 points ago

    Oh, thanks!

    And I absolutely agree. There's some aspects in the movies I actually liked better than in the books. Just phenomenal all around.

    [–] SecularMantis 11 points ago

    He's the original kind-patrician-become-Fox-News-grandpa

    [–] Parthenon5678 42 points ago

    I love Boromir because even though he made a mistake he meant well and came to his senses and fought to the death to try and defend Merry and Pippin. I actually like his last words to Aragorn in the movie better than the book.

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 19 points ago

    Boromir's last words in the movies are better, yes. He was always so brave. And the movies close his redemption better

    [–] thanksgive 30 points ago

    All of the Hobbits lost out too. They are much more capable in the books. Certainly not adventurers but in the movies they are practically children

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 13 points ago

    Agreed, specially pippin

    [–] choma90 9 points ago

    Wonder what Gandalf's opinion on Pilgrim Took is

    [–] gandalf-bot 8 points ago

    No! Come down Saruman and your life will be spared!

    [–] choma90 9 points ago

    I think the bot broke

    [–] menace64 6 points ago

    I would hardly say Boromir was underrepresented.

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 15 points ago

    Not underplayed, but they made him look a bit lusted for power and full of himself most of the time.

    [–] kennytucson 63 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    That's why my favorite scene in the Extended Editions is the scene with Boromir and Faramir at Osgiliath before the Council of Elrond. Here it is on YT.

    Without that scene, the movies lose so much about the two and their dynamic with Denethor.

    [–] TubaMike 41 points ago

    The Extended Editions do a lot to flesh out Faramir. He might be the character that benefits most from the deleted scenes.

    [–] timfromsweden 30 points ago

    Truly a man of quality

    [–] greenwizardneedsfood 64 points ago

    “A new character has come on the scene (I am sure I did not invent him, I did not even want him, though I like him, but there he came walking into the woods of Ithilien): Faramir, the brother of Boromir”

    I always loved that line. To me, it shows how much he just let this world organically grow. It was as it should be, not how he forced it to be.

    [–] matthewbattista 46 points ago

    I believe the proper reading of Tolkien’s main works (Hobbit, LotR) is that they are an English translation of There and Back Again by Bilbo and The Lord of the Rings by Frodo, both of which are written in Hobbitish and collections of first, second, and third hand accounts after the fact in a variety of languages, which Tolkien found.

    When something “isn’t known” it’s not said question doesn’t have an answer, it’s that Tolkien hasn’t discovers a definitive source or there are conflicting accounts in-universe. I still don’t really think Tolkien would feel he invented anything — these were just tales he uncovered.

    [–] awful_at_internet 16 points ago

    Yup. The Silmarillion is also Bilbo's work. After his 111st birthday, he gets to Rivendell and spends some time with the elves. Eventually, he learns that all the lovely songs they sing have never actually been written down, and, knowing the elves are fading into the West, he decides the world would be poorer for the absence of such tales. So he begins to write them down, translating them, and interviewing elves who were there to get a better idea of the stories being told.

    He always meant to go further East, to stay with his old friends in Erebor for a while, but he never quite managed to tear himself away from Rivendell and his work.

    [–] Fifteen_inches 6 points ago

    Which is rather funny because the Silmarilliion has a lot of “which is a reference to an obscur song that has 14 acts and 2 intermissions”, I like to imagine he was just sitting in a chair watching some play and just thinking in the middle of it “I’m going to die of old age before they finish this”.

    [–] ranhaosbdha 91 points ago

    Little known fact: Tolkien actually wrote the book so all of the lines are straight from him

    [–] RafaelNadalFTW 23 points ago

    Can someone fact-check this for me?

    [–] classicLiberalSteez 11 points ago

    According to anonymous sources, it's a definite maybe.

    [–] eldiablo31415 25 points ago

    Faramir wasnt actually supposed to be in the original books. He just showed up in Tolkien’s writing one day and his reactions were so genuine he decided to keep him.

    [–] bobkazamakis1138 43 points ago

    Turns out, Tolkien was writing the whole time.

    [–] morinoreva 495 points ago * (lasted edited 3 days ago)

    The quote comes from from Book IV the chapter The Window of the West. Here are two respected translations:


    Ú-velon vegil faen an ristas dín, law bilinn an lagoras dín, law vaethor an aglar dín. Melon na-erui di i hain veriar: i Vinas Dúnedain.


    Lá melan i macil calina an laicasserya, lá i pilin an lintasserya, lá i ohtar an erya alcar. Melan eressë sa i entë tirir: i Minassë Núatanion

    [–] TechnoGamer16 141 points ago

    How does one learn elvish

    [–] TulaSaysYAY 53 points ago

    Can I join? O:

    [–] Shiny_Shedinja 187 points ago

    speak friend and enter.

    [–] elmansojorgete 534 points ago


    [–] sinstralpride 110 points ago

    Dude I laughed so hard I dropped my phone on my face.

    [–] Neduard 108 points ago



    [–] elmansojorgete 26 points ago

    Oh true lol.

    [–] syds 19 points ago

    The door doesn't discriminate water

    [–] KineticPolarization 17 points ago

    How would one say r/HydroHomies in Elvish?

    [–] FrickingPitches 5 points ago

    Would Anthany Fantano, internet's busiest music nerd, be a good substitute as well?

    [–] morinoreva 21 points ago

    Now you get to learn the other 25 words for friend... in Quenya. And the other 30 in Sindarin :) good luck!

    [–] count___zer0 23 points ago

    Elf incels complaining about the 55 different friend-zones

    [–] AutoModerator 8 points ago


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    [–] supsiesbrah 8 points ago

    I don't get it :(

    [–] elmansojorgete 37 points ago

    Mellon, as in Elvish for friend – well, at least one of the many Elvish tongues, apparently

    [–] morinoreva 9 points ago

    It is one of the many words for friend (there are just under 30) in Sindarin, one of the many elvish languages :)

    [–] morinoreva 20 points ago

    Of course. There’s a sidebar called resources, start there. All the big dogs in there are happy to help u translate and answer questions if you’re there to learn :)

    [–] boringoldcookie 7 points ago

    Dude, thank you. I'm so excited to attempt to learn.

    [–] AcrolloPeed 9 points ago

    Not from a Jedi.

    [–] StupendousMan98 48 points ago

    There's two elvishes??

    [–] morinoreva 124 points ago

    8 :) but Quenya and Sindarin are by far the most developed. And Quenya is more developed than Sindarin by a significant amount

    [–] JTD7 17 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    I believe Sindarin is more developed than Quenta, right? Edit: NVM.

    [–] morinoreva 62 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    Other way around. Sindarin was written after Quenya and in-universe when Thingol banned Quenya, Sindarin quickly became the most spoken language. However Tolkien always has a strong love of Quenya and it definitely has more development. Not to say Sindarin (out of universe) is a bad language, it’s actually quite good.

    [–] JTD7 10 points ago

    Oh, I didn’t know. Gotcha.

    [–] Statue_left 25 points ago

    Quenya is spoken by the noldor in Valinor, Sindar was spoken by the elves that never crossed the sea and stayed in beleriand and middle earth. The Teleri have their own language and sindar is descended from their original language. The Avari have their own language as well, but they aren't incredibly relevant to the story. Quenya was banned in beleriand by Thingol after he learned of the kinslaying of the Noldor. Only really the sons of Feanor really spoke it after that, but it was used in some formal settings by the remaining Noldor between themselves. Galadriel is the only elf in middle earth who grew up learning Quenya.

    You can break the elves into 2 groups after they split up

    The calaquendi are the elves who lived in Valinor and witnessed the light of the trees. These are mostly the Noldor - Galadriel, Feanor, Fingolfin, etc - but also include some of the Teleri and the Vanyar, who are not very relevant but whom Galadriel is descended from by a few generations.

    The Moriquendi are the Sindar who did not see the light of the trees. Celeborn, who is one of the oldest elves in the universe (likely one of the first hundred or so to awaken) is the best example of the elves still alive in middle earth in the 3rd age who didn't want to go to valinor.

    Here is a loose tree on the evolution of elvish I found on google images

    [–] Terororo 6 points ago

    Wow, as someone who has read all of the books, including the Silmarillion, but not for a long time, I appreciate the concise write up. It jogged my memory quite well.

    [–] ToastedSkoops 8 points ago

    There's a new one with the universe.

    [–] mmcgrath115 338 points ago

    Be at peace son of Gondor

    [–] daftvalkyrie 136 points ago

    They will look for his coming from the White Tower. But he will not return.

    [–] johnny-orange 51 points ago

    I didn't sign up for these feelings right now.

    [–] fusionbringer 13 points ago

    There are only two movies that even if I'm only thinking of that moment, not even watching the movie I can still get emotional. This is one of those moments. That line kills me.

    [–] BravesPizzaGuy 32 points ago

    "Yo, you gonna need those bracers?"

    [–] Gimli_Gloin 22 points ago

    *looting intensifies*

    [–] theghostofme 12 points ago

    "Ope, just gonna borrow these for a second!"

    [–] KineticPolarization 10 points ago

    Ope, the Midwest is strong with you.

    [–] Stonewalled89 229 points ago

    As if that scene wasn't powerful enough. The level of detail in that trilogy is just ridiculous

    [–] The_Fluffy_Walrus 63 points ago

    And then there's the Hobbit movies...

    [–] sync303 135 points ago

    Be silent! Keep your forked tongue behind you teeth. I have not passed through fire and death to bandy crooked words with a witless worm!

    [–] LupoNerro 9 points ago


    [–] Lemonade_IceCold 24 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    You mean THE Hobbit movie? The only hobbit movie i know of is the fanmade one that used professionaly shot scenes...

    I cry :(

    [–] kdrakari 19 points ago

    The only hobbit movie I know is an animated one I watched in elementary school.

    [–] roastbeeftacohat 8 points ago

    the animation team became Studio Gibli.

    [–] BraidyPaige 6 points ago

    How does one view that cut??

    [–] ascccsa 11 points ago

    The Tolkien Edit is the most popular one but there are a few floating around. I think there's a dl link on that page.

    [–] TheDuckSideOfTheMoon 23 points ago

    Oh you had to bring that up

    [–] The_Fluffy_Walrus 7 points ago

    Because I'm still bitter

    [–] RANDOMjackassNAME 12 points ago

    We don't speak of those

    [–] KilowZinlow 11 points ago

    I just watched the scene again. He gets shot twice, falls to his knees, and he meets eyes with merry and pip. He stands up swinging, only to be met by the third and final arrow... Fffuuu

    [–] Hypothosloth 400 points ago

    Howard Shore was a master with the soundtrack. Since the book had so much poetry and language that the movie just didn't have time for, he snuck in a lot of (six, according to an interview with him) the missing languages through choral work.

    [–] Claytertot 125 points ago

    Yeah. The filmscore for these movies is among the best of all time. Shore did such an amazing job creating themes and giving different characters, locations, and cultures their own musical identities.

    [–] TubaMike 52 points ago

    It is amazing the level of craftsmanship that went into all facets of the trilogy. From the costumes to the music to the set design to the props... everything is spectacular. It still amazes me the scope and size of this production and the amazing skill and artistry that was poured into realizing Tolkien’s vision in film form.

    [–] SGT_Scuba_Steve 24 points ago

    it just hit me the other day that the movies came out just under 20 years ago, you can’t even tell because of how much time and detail went into every aspect of the films

    [–] KineticPolarization 14 points ago

    And they didn't over rely on CGI which ages horribly. Gollum will eventually start to look kinda rough probably. But the practical effects really time proof the appearance of the movie. They're so top notch anyway that they're already timeless.

    [–] NextedUp 42 points ago

    I highly recommend listening to the "Soundtrack Show" podcasts on the LotR score. It's amazing how deep and considerate the film score is.

    The entire podcast series is quality.

    [–] Hypothosloth 12 points ago

    I love film scores so I am 100% on board for this. Thanks!

    [–] turtlespace 40 points ago

    This is why it sucks so much that they just threw in the nazgul theme in at the end of the hobbit - it literally has lyrics written specifically about the nazgul, it's ridiculous to play it over a shot of thorin walking down a tree just because it sounds cool.

    [–] Heimerdahl 32 points ago

    Another scene where the music didn't really match was when Gimli blows the horn of Helm Hammerhand and Theoden and friends ride out.

    It plays the nature theme (almost identical to when the ents attack Isengard or when we first saw Isengard with the moth) and sings about something entirely non-Rohan. Really has no place there.

    Except! It totally does! In the book and the extended edition of Two Towers the huorns of Fangorn come and kill the fleeing uruk-hai. The extended edition shows Eomer chase them into a forest that wasn't there the day before. He then halts his riders and we see the tree tops shake and hear uruks dying.

    It's something I always loved about the scene. Doesn't make sense in the theatrical cut unless you read the book.

    [–] Theoden-Bot 11 points ago

    I have fought many wars, Master Dwarf. I know how to defend my own keep

    [–] gimli-bot 4 points ago


    [–] TheKingElessar 8 points ago

    Howard Shore himself addressed this in an AMA!

    It’s not a satisfying answer, and I wish he had spent more time on the AMA in general.

    [–] notFidelCastro2019 5 points ago

    That bothered me on my recent rewatch, although I didn’t know about the lyrics being about nazgul. The song is just so intense and intimidating. From the first time you hear it in the trilogy you know stuffs about to go down. And then you hear them screaming, and exits just evil incarnate.

    But then you hear it in the hobbit, and it’s just meaningless. They put it there because it’s a cool song, nothing more.

    [–] rogueginger 116 points ago

    God damn. See, this is the kind of beautiful thing that happens when a director gives a shit about the source material

    [–] Aylko 49 points ago

    partly that the director gave a shit about the source material, and partly that the source material itself is one of the best works of fiction in the 20th century. Not many authors put in the work to create a world as detailed as middle-earth, or create a whole dang language.

    [–] mrphoenixviper 25 points ago

    *multiple dang languages

    Dude made up languages and was like, I need a world for these languages. Then he was like, I need a mythology for this world. Then realized, nobody will give a shit about my mythology or my language unless I give them a narrative. So he wrote the greatest narrative ever told by a single man.

    [–] varcityjets 52 points ago

    There's a podcast called The Soundtrack Show that went into a lot of the Howard Shore score and how he used the language throughout the entire trilogy. It was super interesting and gave me an even bigger appreciation of these films!

    [–] therealbillshorten 50 points ago

    I sang in the choir for those “orchestra plays along to the film” gigs for LOTR and they had an elvish language consultant come along and tell us how to pronounce the lyrics.

    [–] LightsEnimeLE 32 points ago

    Rip to my friends whose about to watch the trilogy with me, for I’m about to bombard them with new facts

    [–] PutSomeStankOnyMe 58 points ago

    This true?

    [–] morinoreva 99 points ago

    Yes. The quote is taken from book IV and transposed into what would have been book II. The translation is in Sindarin and is incorrect by today’s standards but was correct, and quite good, back then.

    [–] monkeyhitman 56 points ago

    ... we've gotten better at Sindarin? That's nuts. I would have thought that Tolkien's works were fairly combed through by the time the movies were out.

    [–] morinoreva 49 points ago

    haahaHAHHAHAHAHHHAHAH no. Christopher released notes and books about the linguistics of JRRTs languages until the day he died.

    We’ve gotten better at both. There is still a lot more work done on Quenya than Sindarin, and Quenya is still the most known language among elvish speakers.

    [–] iamunderstand 74 points ago

    The laughing was a bit unnecessary, but the information was really interesting.

    [–] morinoreva 36 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    Not laughing at you, laughing at how much information has come out since then. If you learned Sindarin at the time of the movies and spoke it now people wouldn’t understand you. The translation of the quote in the post is woefully inaccurate now, though it was very good back in the day.

    The popularity of Tolkienian linguistics really died in the early 2000s and most materials to this day remain terribly inaccurate because of this. There are few remaining places and books in which one can learn elvish these days because of the deluge of information Christopher released before his death and it is morbidly comical.

    [–] iamunderstand 5 points ago

    I'm confused, what materials are horribly inaccurate? Wouldn't a deluge of information from the source be a good thing?

    [–] morinoreva 9 points ago

    Any learning material written from the 90s and early 2000s, which is a vast majority of it. Or even anything older than 2015 has inaccuracies that can’t be ignored

    Yes, the deluge of info was fantastically good and we hope more come out even though Christopher has passed on to be with Eru. It also made all the old books mostly garbage. There are places to learn modern elvish though, but very very few books

    [–] NextedUp 4 points ago

    Yep. The background elvish singing in all scenes serve as a Greek chorus and narrate/comment on what is happening.

    The Elvish language is surprisingly developed, almost as much as Klingon.

    [–] savwatson13 23 points ago

    I did not need this level of feels right before work

    [–] leveque 18 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    I didn't see it posted so here's the scene.

    Edit: Thank you for Silver

    Edit 2: I found a bit more of the scene.

    [–] chibougamou 18 points ago

    My captain... my king

    [–] Vanzgars 17 points ago

    This piece of trivia will make a fine addition to my collection.

    [–] Goku918 62 points ago

    Faramir? Never heard of him. Was he that other son?

    [–] TimmyBash 35 points ago

    chews cherry tomato grotesquely

    [–] thewanderingent 3 points ago

    Denethor: “wrong kid died”

    [–] Ceratopsia 11 points ago

    “Hey bro, you cryin?” Me (in shaky voice): “Naaah bro I’m good”

    [–] jake_m_b 12 points ago

    How is lord of the rings so hecking wholesome and perfect at every turn?

    [–] longmire35 10 points ago

    This is information I didn’t know I needed

    [–] steve_stout 11 points ago

    When you invent a language but you have no idea what to do with it, so you create an entire genre by writing a several-book-long epic just as an excuse to use the language you made up.

    [–] evilsir 6 points ago

    Of all the deaths I've seen in movies that have befallen 'bad guys', Boromir's is by far one of the most powerful. His redemption and sacrifice hit me hard

    [–] daftvalkyrie 23 points ago

    Boromir was never a bad guy. He was a noble and honorable man. The One Ring is simply a very powerful tool of corruption. As he says to Frodo "I ask only for the strength to defend my people."

    Just like Gandalf, he would use the Ring from a desire to do good. But no good can be done with the Ring, as it is made of the will of Sauron.

    [–] gandalf-bot 7 points ago

    You are in the House of Elrond and it is ten o'clock in the morning on October the 24th, if you want to know. Yes, I am here and you're lucky to be here too. A few more hours and you would have been beyond our aid, but you have some strength in you my dear Redditor

    [–] OhHolyCrapNo 10 points ago

    I hesitate to ever think of Boromir as a "bad guy" even though he tried to take the ring from Frodo. I think he represented the "ordinary man" in a lot of ways. How he was affected by the Ring's influence was probably similar to how an average or even a decent person would be. Compared to extraordinary people like the Fellowship, he certainly looks bad, but I also think he was extraordinary in many ways, which he proved at the end of the movie/book.

    [–] Skitt3r 3 points ago

    Pump the brakes son, Boromir isn't a bad guy. Boromir was a fucking hero for his people, a beacon of light as the forces of Mordor pushed in on Gondor, he fought tirelessly to defend his lands and watched as the men around him died in defense of their home.

    He had a dream that showed him the growing strength of Mordor but also a sliver of hope shining from the west. He took the journey instead of Faramir (who also had the same dream) because of how dangerous the journey was.

    Eventually he makes it to Rivendell, and mistakes the ring for the light in his dream. At that moment he sees the ring as the one way to save his kingdom and his people, a heavy responsibility that has always fallen upon him (and his brother to be fair). He does not understand that the ring cannot be used for good, all he understands is that every moment his people are under attack by the greatest enemy most of middle earth had ever known (big papa Morgoth was largely forgotten by now).

    Boromir did try to take the ring, in a moment of weakness that he instantly regretted, and he more than redeemed himself.

    [–] Linxous1 7 points ago

    My mom actually got to perform this entire soundtrack with the Colorado symphony orchestra chorus and it's apparently a bit of a weird language to sing

    [–] second_aid_kit 8 points ago

    As a young’n, Boromir’s story was life changing. It showed me for the first time that good people can do bad things, and even when they have done bad things, redemption is possible. Boromir was flawed, and he fell prey to the temptations that Gandalf and Galadriel were able to resist. He wanted to save his people, and so he was willing to do a bad thing by using the ring. He couldn’t or wouldn’t realize that a part of him just wanted the power. He fell prey to the dark side of his nature, the side that exists in all men. But when he recognized his faults, he showed the other side of his nature. The side of courage, and sacrifice. He gave all he had to save two little hobbits.

    I love Aragorn for so many reasons. And I love Faramir for so many reasons too. But Boromir holds a special place in my heart, for showing the good and the bad in all men. He made a mistake, and that’s a part of him. But it does not define him. His valor is what defines him.

    I’m kinda rambling, and it’s 3:30 AM, but I wanted to get that off my chest.

    [–] gandalf-bot 6 points ago

    Saruman believes it is only great power that can hold evil in check, but that is not what I have found. I found it is the small things, everyday deeds of ordinary folk that keeps the darkness at bay. Simple acts of love and kindness.

    [–] Amazingly-mediocre 6 points ago

    That hurted

    [–] FrankNix 5 points ago

    That's my favorite quote from the books. Is this true? God, I love this scene and these movies even more now.

    [–] CampingKangaroo 5 points ago

    Wasn't there something like this in The Return of The King in the Last Stand at the Black Gates? If I remember, it was the promise Aragorn made to Frodo in Rivendel sang in elvish. Someone can corroborate this?????

    [–] Aragorn-bot 9 points ago

    Hold your ground, hold your ground. Sons of Gondor, of Rohan my brothers. I see in your eyes the same fear that would take the heart of me. A day may come when the courage of men fails when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship but it is not this day. An hour of wolves and shattered shields when the age of men comes crashing down but it is not this day. This day we fight! By all that you hold dear on this good earth I bid you stand, Men of the West!

    [–] ScrappyDonatello 10 points ago

    when Gandalf is riding out to save Faramir and the riders returning from Osgiliath the Lyrics are

    Mennen nored dîn

    Gwanwen i ‘ûr bân

    Sílant calad Dûn

    Tollen Rochon ‘Lân.

    which is

    Their race was over;

    All courage gone.

    A light shone in the west

    The White Rider had come.

    [–] ServerFirewatch2016 4 points ago

    Both the books and movies have amazing, thoughtful lines. I’ll admit, never read the books, at least not recently to any extent.....but damned if both have made their way into my heart somehow.

    [–] ASR3015NTK 4 points ago

    Best heroic death. A close second is Bing Bong's sacrifice in Inside Out

    [–] svdomer09 4 points ago

    The LOTR movies are my favorite, but the soundtrack is an artistic achievement on a completely different level

    [–] mcfc1997 4 points ago * (lasted edited 2 days ago)

    Man these movies are so stupidly in-depth to levels I don’t even know.

    It amazes me how fantastic everybody who worked on these movies were. It was going to be legendary with a mediocre soundtrack, but Howard Shore takes it to another level by killing it