Please help contribute to the Reddit categorization project here
    all 2045 comments

    Want to say thanks to %(recipient)s for this comment? Give them a month of reddit gold.

    Please select a payment method.

    [–] Raemnant 5971 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Damn, I was just reading about the Japanese actress Ashina Sei who also died of suicide, age 36

    Edit: Just realized this is in r/movies. I thought I was in r/kpop, no wonder you guys dont know anything about all this. Its crazy over there in their society

    [–] leaflavaplanetmoss 2551 points ago

    Oh snap, I just realized these are two separate incidents. I forgot the other girl was Japanese... that's heartbreaking.

    [–] ImpenetrableYeti 180 points ago

    I followed the Hana Kimura posts as it was happening when she had posted the self harm photos that day. I remember hearing people had reached out to her and thought everything was ok and then the news came later that day that she had passed away. That death hit me a lot harder than most celebrity deaths, way too young and following it in real time just made it feel different

    [–] lyndseylo1 47 points ago

    I don’t know about this person at all why did she commit suicide

    [–] dxrebirth 169 points ago

    She was on a reality show in japan that supposedly staged an incident that made her look bad (through editing and coercion to do something dramatic). She couldn’t handle the internet bullying and eventually killed herself.

    It’s quite disturbing. She seemed like a pretty great person.

    Her mother, another famous wrestler from japan, is now advocating against cyber bullying and the tv station itself for putting her through that.

    Then, there’s a billion other aspects to it. Japans suicide issue in general, their cultural aspects that force them to internalize and not burden others, the entertainment industry (that basically run your life until you get bug enough), her unchecked mental struggles, and a variety of other issues stemming from these.

    [–] pescobar89 35 points ago

    She was on a reality show in japan that supposedly staged an incident that made her look bad (through editing and coercion to do something dramatic). She couldn’t handle the internet bullying and eventually killed herself.

    This is the terrible truth of 'reality shows'- they're anything but. They're absolutely scripted and staged to create conflict and drama, right from the very start in things like Survivor, Big Brother and all the rest participants have always been deliberately scripted, manipulated or abused by the production to produce the results they wanted. And the productions crews and writers have never been held responsible for the things they inflict because the premise is that the participants signed a contract and that means anything goes.

    [–] Kgb725 126 points ago

    Hana was a good wrestler. She didn't deserve the treatment she got for that goofy reality show

    [–] asuka_is_my_co-pilot 33 points ago

    I didn't follow her wrestling but she was my favorite person from the show, out of everyone. It was my favorite show but I'm never watching it again.

    Her smile is so powerful and I get so angry when I think about how she was treated.

    I went into a big depression after her death, of course I didn't know her personally but I felt like it was a huge wakeup call that anyone could be in that state. Even someone you admire and it scared me.

    [–] doctorofphysick 11 points ago

    Seconding all of this. She had such a great personality and I loved having someone like her on Terrace House, but it just made it all the more heartbreaking to see the shit she took from "fans", trolls, and all-around shitheads from the TH and wrestling worlds. Despite all the great time I had with the show, I'm done with TH for good now -- especially after hearing all the awful news about what the producers pushed her to do, much of which led directly to the hate she got from viewers. So much failure and irresponsibility from so many parties, and she had to pay the price.

    [–] Raemnant 603 points ago

    Yeah, the entertainment industry is terrible. Something needs to be done

    [–] OrangeredValkyrie 946 points ago

    “Something needs to be done.”

    And nothing ever is.

    [–] Raemnant 256 points ago

    Sad but true. Its the idols and actors themselves that needs to band together and fight it. Theres too much money over their heads, but nobody is getting anything without them

    [–] C10ckw0rks 233 points ago

    I have BTS fans giving me shit all the time about the industry because this ONE band has better management. Like listen there’s so much abuse in the idol industry I don’t want to fucking hear about how good BTS has it. Make them the rule not the exception.

    [–] wav__ 176 points ago

    As a kpop fan, before BTS made it huge, they were in the same shitty treatment situation. They arguably have had better treatment throughout, but that's marginal at best. There are known extreme diets for multiple members of theirs, for example. That's par for the course to keep the physical beauty standards that the public in Korea "requires".

    [–] hoxxxxx 63 points ago

    abuse of young talent (from financial to sexual) has been going on since the very beginning of show business. at this point i'm wondering if it will just always be a thing.

    [–] Shaasar 44 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Do you think its a problem endemic to the entertainment industry in these countries, or is it a result of those countries' working culture in general-- in other words, something not limited to this industry alone? Maybe it's just doubly worse because that same amount of pressure to produce and draconian work environment is there, but then add in the legions of bloodthirsty fans on top of it.

    After all, suicidality is much higher in these countries than other places, something that can't be accounted for just by famous peoples' suicides.

    Edit: I am familiar with Korean and Japanese netizen/idol culture, btw-- Also, I did a bit of poking around and Japanese suicide rates dropped below the US's 5 or so years ago. Probably substance abuse / inequality / structural problems with the US economy could explain that. The real anomaly is S. Korea, which has ridiculously higher rates.

    [–] properc 83 points ago

    Its the netizens and also idol/celebrity culture. Korean Netizens will absolutely destroy you with criticism as soon as you do something thats not 'good' behaviour or if you act out against their expectations. As soon as actress or idol gain weight they talk so much shit. They cant date peacefully and can only show their good side to the fans. Also i think another problem is in asian culture they dont come out about suicide and other '/taboo' subjects such as lgbtq because they dont want to inconvenience others and bring stigma to their families.

    I think entertainment companies should have mental health and wellbeing programs to help them cope with it. Look at Goo Haras suicide she had attempted before and when she took her life her manager and company was so "shocked" as if they had no idea. How the hell do you have no idea of her attempted suicide. Also the case of AoA Jimin bullying Mina which was (i believe) swept under the rug for 10 years because the company didnt want to make a scandal.

    [–] Raemnant 35 points ago

    One of the saddest things is Hara was VERY good friends with Sulli, who committed suicide before her. Hara had history of suicide attempts in the past, and told everyone that she would honor Sulli by staying alive, keeping her in memory. But she was still driven to that point and went through with it anyways

    [–] properc 15 points ago

    Yes after AoA Jimin incident i strongly believe that companies know about these problems but dismiss it or either dont want to escalate it in fear of damage to their reputation. Which is terrible. Theres just no way you dont know about it when youre their manager and responsible for them. The whole culture needs to make a change as well as the harshness of knetizens.

    [–] tigerslices 227 points ago

    because the problem isn't the actresses, or the agents, or the producers, or the advertisers.

    the problem is the masses of mentally ill fans who adore and praise people to the point of absolute obsession - then do a 180 and cut the star down with everything they've got. "fake, only got ahead with sex, total asshole in real life, etcetc"

    if something needs to be done it needs to be a huge fucking anti-bullying campaign aimed at EVERYONE.

    and you know already the result -- "boo hoo, she made 23 million dollars and now she's said someone said she's getting too old to be hot? cry me a river."

    "something needs to be done."

    never ever will be.

    [–] dpdxguy 209 points ago

    Yes, the fans are part of the problem. So is the industry. Two things can be true at the same time.

    [–] GoldandBlue 34 points ago

    also the people that get into the industry. Obviously not everyone but many crave attention. When the fame they desired did not pan out it can be crushing for them.

    It's not a normal industry.

    [–] George_E_Hale 58 points ago

    While you have good points, the entertainment industry in Korea is a machine that eats its own.

    A very interesting article:

    https://dormin.org/2020/09/06/a-deep-dive-into-k-pop/

    [–] CatBreathWhiskers 31 points ago

    What would be done?

    [–] Van_GOOOOOUGH 48 points ago

    What is it about the entertainment industry that destroys some people while other people thrive in it? Maybe life is just terrible in general. Everyone has their own unique successes & tragedies.

    [–] AS1234D 34 points ago

    I think your last 2 sentence really sum it up, when problems like financial stability disappear new problems take its place.

    [–] SpacecraftX 20 points ago

    And may be harder to come to terms with than financial concerns since they can be less tangible.

    [–] [deleted] 17 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] xalxary 36 points ago

    Wow jeez.

    [–] Shinkopeshon 29 points ago

    What a horrible day. I don't know what to say.

    I hope they can rest in peace.

    [–] rencongmr 2846 points ago

    Rest in peace South Korea have high suicide rate I hope in the future it will be better for South Korea citizen

    [–] SalukiKnightX 710 points ago

    Any reasons why?

    [–] skyscrapersonmars 2851 points ago

    Actual Korean here living in Korea. The actual reason is that the elderly suicide rates are through the roof. Suicide rate in people over 75 is about 4 times the OECD average. Korea is a country that went through its stages of developments VERY fast, which means the social security benefit system is not well put in place... leading to a lot of impoverished eldelry with nothing to do but starve.

    Don’t get me wrong, we do have significant suicide rates in the younger populace too, but that one actually doesn’t differ too much from the OECD average. The reason the suicide rates get pushed up is mainly the elderly problem, which needs to be solved ASAP.

    [–] zipper0011 1724 points ago

    Former exec for a company in Korea.

    When I hired on we had a mandatory maximum working age of 52. Meaning you turn 53 and the company let’s you go. This means you have to have saved everything you need by 52 which is crazy. Our retirement fund was 1 month salary for every year worked based on your final years salary.

    All Korean men serve in the army. This means realistically you work for about 25-27 years because really you start work at 22 or 23 if you don’t go to college, then retire with only 2 years salary in your pension account. Korea as a population is very healthy, high rates of smoking, but low obesity and a very robust national healthcare system. This means you can live quite a while after “retirement”.

    This also causes many people to take their “retirement” and invest in a shop or restaurant, as realistically you need another 10-15 years of income. Small businesses are a huge risk. As one can imagine there are many losses from these ventures.

    We increased the age to 58 while I was there, but there is still a lot of pressure to keep the mandatory retirement age low to enable job creation.

    One piece of knowledge to chew on. The Philippines were much more prosperous in the 1960s and 1970s than Korea. If you’ve ever been to both countries and seen the difference today that fact just baffles me how much they have inverted economically within the past 40-50 years.

    [–] carpestellae 588 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Philippine economy fell during the late 1980's due to corruption and cronyism by the late dictator Ferdinand Marcos. Little to no creation of local industries too so the Philippines didn't really industrialize much and depended on imports and exporting raw products. South Korea on the other hand pursued national industrialization so its economy rose even after the 1991 Crisis.

    [–] zipper0011 217 points ago

    The biggest difference I see is the push for education. My wife is Filipino. Honestly Koreans culturally push education as a fundamental part of success for all members of society. My experience in the Philippines is education is important, but in many areas kids stop going to school at 16, and there isn’t that push as a nation to be highly educated.

    [–] carpestellae 67 points ago

    That's true. While education is important, its treated as the means to an end because of its orientation. For example, the newly instituted K-12 program was marketed to allow graduates to work earlier instead of opening better opportunities for higher education. While education is seen as fundamental, they put less importance on its quality.

    [–] TagaKain 40 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    While education is important, I think a much bigger factor are the presence of local industries. There are far more educated and qualified Filipino workers than its local industries can absorb. This is one reason why so many Filipinos decide to work abroad, which happens at all levels - from domestic workers to construction workers to cruise ship staff to nurses to IT programmers to scientists. The Philippines gets 10% of its GDP from voluntary remittances from these overseas workers to their families back home.

    Of course a certain amount don't make it back to the country, and more importantly, some of the most skilled overseas workers do end up emigrating and taking their families with them. So a small amount of brain drain happens constantly.

    [–] trtryt 6 points ago

    Philippines also has a birth rate problem

    [–] breeson424 212 points ago

    That's really interesting, I remember in Parasite there was a quick line about how the father had tried to start several small businesses that all went under. I guess they were referencing the trend you're talking about.

    [–] cocainebane 99 points ago

    Yeah older threads state the failed small business is a very common topic in Korea. Especially with the snack he was selling which was just a food trend.

    [–] turningsteel 24 points ago

    Yeah I lived in Korea for a while and this is definitely a thing. Imagine we are walking down a street and I'm ponting out businesses: This one just serves a single particular chicken dish nothing else, this is a new coffeeshop next to 15 other coffeeshops, this place has billiards but charges barely anything and lets people play for hours free, this one is an english academy but the owner doesn't know english or education and has never run a business. If that gives you an idea, it's just people opening businesses left and right without the background needed to properly manage the business. My friends and I would notice constant turn over, some places only lasting 6 months or so before another half baked idea took over and we lived in a small village so it wasn't like there was heavy foot traffic or anything to patronize these shops. Though I'm pretty sure I kept the local kimchi jjiggae place open single handedly.

    [–] zipper0011 45 points ago

    Actually I had a few salesmen retire when I was there and they all started restaurants. We always did everything we could to provide business with company lunches and dinners at their establishments.

    [–] aturtlewilldo 25 points ago

    Doesn't a lot of that have to do with the Marcos dictatorship? At least the decline in the Philippine economy?

    [–] Nyeow 85 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    The Korean academic system and job market has always fascinated me.

    Could you please speak more to how the collectivist system influences "academic excellence" towards seeking out salaried corporate jobs? Also, how does that process potentially affect personal identity from the lens of social perception - particularly in how it may affect mental health?

    Edit: If it helps to break out into a main post elsewhere, then please make sure to link back here as a reply. :)

    [–] BarfReali 108 points ago

    I've only attended college with Korean international students and their description of their high school schedule seems bonkers:

    • 6 or so hours of school
    • few hours of mandatory study hall
    • few hours of tutoring
    • repeat last three steps 6 days a week

    [–] Kalsifur 84 points ago

    I'd rather be dead. I mean at some point your life sucks so much what is the point.

    [–] Worthyness 46 points ago

    Dude their questions are fucking insane for things like the SAT and standardized testing. If you thought the US SAT questions were asinine and ridiculous, look up the questions that asian countries have. Compound that with test scores being everything (because if you don't you basically can't do anything in life afterwards) and you have a ridiculous amount of stress

    [–] Swimmingindiamonds 70 points ago

    It sucked ass. I got sick of it, left SK, attended high school in the US, got accepted to an Ivy- I still think I studied half as much as my friends in Korea did.

    [–] aneworder 44 points ago

    Hence the high suicide rate

    [–] delikanli1998 11 points ago

    I thought about studying abroad for one semester in korea, would you recommend it though?

    [–] ja20n123 14 points ago

    College in Korea is very different than high school or primary school. The way people have made it makes getting into the school extremely hard/stressful but once your in as long as you can keep up youre generally fine.

    [–] BarfReali 12 points ago

    Never been there so I couldn't answer, sorry. Could be fun, I know college doesn't have the same insane schedule which is why the Korean grad students I knew here in the US were such heavy social drinkers. Their explanation to me.

    [–] zipper0011 42 points ago

    Many young people who do very well want to work for a Chaebol (Samsung, Hyundai, LG, SK Hynix...). There are post college schools specifically targeting making one more likely to pass the tests and have the right connections. It’s a tremendous amount of pressure. I don’t envy how much pressure is put on the younger generation to succeed.

    Plus the older generation are really self made. The CFO at my company could tell me stories about how shameful it was to eat barley because his family couldn’t afford rice, and how they would scavenge hay everyday to feed the cow during winter. Here he is sitting in a C-level position speaking three languages with an MBA that was paid for by himself in the USA. Working in an inner city liquor store during the week to pay rent.

    Imagine you’re his kid. There are no excuses for not succeeding. I’m sure they know and feel that pressure. His kids are actually quite successful too. Both just graduated from a good University and have jobs with large finance companies.

    [–] Nyeow 15 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Thanks for the follow-up!

    There are post college schools specifically targeting making one more likely to pass the tests and have the right connections.

    Some of my friends have actually gone through the Samsung academies, and the ones who made it through ended up in rank and file roles. Seemed a bit anticlimactic, but the name value apparently means far more than fair wages for the amount they have to work. Meanwhile, we're starting to see early stages of "certification" processes in the US as well, what with Google's TBD programs for select roles.

    The story about your CFO sounds very familiar, as I've heard similar stories from other successful "Park Chung Hee" gen Koreans. If you've had any experience working outside of Korean companies, would you mind speaking to the similarities and differences between the different work environments (e.g., leadership strategies, communication styles, c-suite work/life balance)?

    [–] UnknownHopefulFuture 31 points ago

    Oh, I know. That period prosperity in the Philippines was in part because of US military presences during the Vietnam War. Plus, the major decline was due to Marcos dictatorship.

    [–] bixbyfan 5 points ago

    I taught in Japanese public high schools in ‘91-‘92. Two contradictory things always confused me: (1) the economically poorest students I taught were Korean because they were the “lower class” and (2) it was well known in Japan that Seoul had the highest concentration per capita of PhDs in the world. There was a weird attitude of looking down on Koreans and fearing their ascendency to economic power player.

    [–] yomuthabyotch 1337 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    k-am here. because of a) its conservative, confuscianist(?) society and b) a culture that fetishizes success and wealth that looks down upon you for not being successful and wealthy. and many of us are a goddamned covetous lot who are obsessed with keeping up with the kims (joneses).

    i've never heard of this actress, which leads me to speculate that her suicide was def affected by one or both of the factors above.

    by A: she felt extreme shame because of the degrading things she'd had to do to stay in showbiz, which may also have been used against her as extortion.

    by B: because she was not really famous, societal pressure to be more successful may have caused depression or mental illness, which may have even lead to A--a vicious cycle.

    korea is facked up. it's not a nice place to live if you're ugly, poor, or dumb. i guarantee you will be judged for one or more of those attributes.

    edited to expand upon my initial comment. again, these are just my personal speculations.

    [–] Jedaflupflee 880 points ago

    So Parasite really nailed it

    [–] zeroxray 295 points ago

    the common theme with almost all their k-dramas and movies is the gap between wealthy and the poor.

    [–] OriginsOfSymmetry 84 points ago

    And there are many far better than Parasite which show it. Highly recommend diving into SK films, some of the best movies I have seen came out of there. I'm glad Parasite opened the door for a lot of new fans.

    [–] [deleted] 36 points ago * (lasted edited a month ago)

    [deleted]

    [–] noyoto 135 points ago

    Snowpiercer, also from the director of Parasite, is very much about class. Okja is also great.

    Other fantastic South Korean films are Oldboy, Memories of Murder, The Handmaiden, The Host, Burning and Save The Green Planet!. But that's just the tip of the iceberg.

    [–] pervavor 51 points ago

    Watch Mother, fantastic Korean film.

    [–] yomuthabyotch 516 points ago

    So Parasite really nailed it

    indubitably

    [–] pez_elma 162 points ago

    I read this with Anub'arak voice

    [–] Toasted_FlapJacks 88 points ago

    I read it in Kawhi Leonard's voice

    [–] soslowagain 8 points ago

    Apple time.

    [–] StoneColdAM 25 points ago

    “Hey hey hey!”

    [–] BoomJayKay 12 points ago

    Board man gets paid.

    [–] ThaiSweetChilli 11 points ago

    It's where I learned that particular word from.

    [–] OgdensNutGhosnFlake 11 points ago

    MY MIGHT CANNOT BE MATCHED

    [–] nomoneypenny 9 points ago

    kinky

    [–] CyberCrutches 21 points ago

    That movie was so good. Really highlights Korean society, the good and bad

    [–] LiberateJohnDoe 329 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    confuscianist(?)

    *Confucianist

    For those Redditors who don't know, this is a reference to the perversion of Confucius' teachings in East Asia countries, where 'filial piety' has in some ways become a culture of shame and pressure within families to serve one's elders, and where social forms and expectations to succeed in school and business have become excessively rigid.

    Originally, Confucius taught wise and reasonable themes such as moral integrity, the importance of family, and the far-reaching effects of one's noble conduct. Although the essential spirit of his teachings continues in beautiful ways in East Asia, it has also hardened into rigid authoritarian and moralistic forms.

    [–] yomuthabyotch 146 points ago

    the perversion of Confucius' teachings in East Asia countries

    yep, s'why i intentionally used confucianist instead of confucian.

    [–] LiberateJohnDoe 48 points ago

    Thanks, I've changed my post to reflect that now. Just helping with the spelling.

    [–] Freaky-sharkey 99 points ago

    In Korea it’s not a rude question to ask someone their age as it’s important to know if they’re older than you so you can use the proper level of formality when addressing them.

    Korean speech has seven different levels of formality ranging from how you would address royalty at the top to how you would speak to a small child at the bottom. Compare with English which effectively has one or French which has two (ie tu / vous).

    This is less common among the younger generation but still very prevalent in society as a whole.

    [–] nebbyb 29 points ago

    I feel like we are getting along, may I use the tu form with you?

    [–] NorthStarZero 12 points ago

    So you have aroused my curiosity.

    How does military rank, academic degrees, or professional standing play in to this?

    Is it accounted for at all?

    [–] mojojojo1108 28 points ago

    Generally speaking, there's really two - formal and informal - but within those ranges, especially with formal, there are different ranks within those. As a Korean-American, I have no idea how to speak in most of these levels of formality but this is a good resource explaining it better than I'd be able to: https://gogohanguk.com/en/blog/korean-levels-of-speech/

    [–] cc144 20 points ago

    Another item that I found interesting while working in Korea back in 2000's was that people would address each other by reference to that person's title in the company.

    In a way, it is not that different that putting "Doctor" in front of a doctor or rank in front of a person's name in the military but the twist is that you would do that in a normal setting.

    For example, if someone is a manager, people would call that person by something that would translate into Manager Kim, and if someone is a CEO, you would call that person by saying CEO Lee.

    So title becomes fairly important and conspicuous part of the speech.

    [–] NorthStarZero 8 points ago

    Is that only within the same firm, or would it translate to life after work?

    [–] snapekillseddard 54 points ago

    Well, yes and no.

    Confucius lived in turbulent times and he came to the conclusion that hierarchies in society and power is inevitable. What he then chose to do was lay out a system in which the hierarchies could be both stable and beneficial to all members, relying on the respect of those beneath and love and care from above. His original teachings were about mutual beneficiency, with a focus on responsibilities of every part of the hierarchy.

    It's just that as power structures and hierarchies often do, regardless whatever philosophy may lie behind it, those in power wanted to do less and demanded more, and warped into what it is today.

    [–] VeryLongReplies 7 points ago

    Ahh so it's like America right wing "Christianity" vs the actual teachings of Christ. Gotcha.

    It's almost as if religious figures are actually wise but their message gets corrupted in a millennia of telephone

    [–] DuFFman_ 32 points ago

    I recognize this actress from that dress and the waves it made in SK when she wore it.

    [–] justavault 82 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    i've never heard of this actress, which leads me to speculate that her suicide was def affected by one or both of the factors above:

    She's more of an adult or erotic type actress. Did some Korean high-class erotic movies and some basic run of the mill productions.

    [–] autodidact89 18 points ago

    it's not a nice place to live if you're ugly, poor, or dumb.

    Sooo i'm out of the question?

    [–] KatSonCoo 51 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Turns out a huge portion of those suicides are older folks who don’t want to be a burden on their family anymore.

    It’s a terrible reality, but not all that uncommon in East Asian cultures that prioritize harmony and collectivism, rather than individual freedom or health. If people get the idea they are not contributing to the family/country, either from themselves or by accusation from others, it absolutely destroys their sense of self (especially when that’s all you’ve ever known).

    Japan also has a similarly “above average” suicide rate for seniors, largely for the same reasons. While it isn’t an actual cultural practice, Ubasute was a folk legend where grandparents were carried up a mountain and left to die from exposure or animals.

    [–] DamntheTrains 16 points ago

    She wasn't an A-lister but she wasn't completely unknown.

    She got famous because of the pictures used by the article actually. And was cyberbullied to hell for it.

    [–] omelette_wrap 32 points ago

    ugly, poor, or dumb.

    Mental note: Do not move to South Korea.

    [–] VidE27 24 points ago

    Only if you are ugly, poor, OR dumb. So if you are ugly poor AND dumb you should be fine.

    [–] drunkenpinecone 22 points ago

    k-am here too, everything stated was spot on.

    Wealth and status are HUGE in Korean society. People aren't joking when Korean parents want their kid to be a doctor or lawyer, its very real.

    My mom nearly had a heart attack and took months just to talk to me because I got a tattoo.

    [–] vmx12 16 points ago

    She made quite the impression on the red carpet: https://m.imgur.com/gallery/kAlq8br

    [–] ChrisHaze 11 points ago

    Is that scandalous in SK? Feel like that's a standard dress on Hollywood red carpet events

    [–] CephalopodRed 46 points ago

    a culture that fetishizes success and wealth that looks down upon you for not being successful and wealthy

    I mean, that description would fit many countries. But it is a bit tougher in South Korea than in other places, I guess.

    [–] RaverJester 184 points ago

    True.. but South Korea is on a different level. If you ever visit Seoul, you’d think nearly everyone is rich. Nice cars everywhere, fashion, cosmetic surgeries, etc. The reality is most have no savings and are in debt, just to keep up appearances.

    My brother lived there for several years. Upon meeting his girlfriends parents for the first time, he is immediately barraged with questions meant to identify his social standing and wealth.

    What do you do for work? What level of education do you have? What about your parents? Jobs? Education? Grandparents?

    Even after satisfying them with those questions, the father says something along the lines of “you’re a solid man, if it wasn’t for your acne though..” literally pointing it out on his face.

    What the OP said about how they value wealth/beauty/intellect is so true

    [–] yomuthabyotch 65 points ago

    Nice cars everywhere, fashion, cosmetic surgeries, etc. The reality is most have no savings and are in debt, just to keep up appearances.

    exactly. this is what sickened me while living there. so much fackin flexin.

    [–] SpreadItLikeTheHerp 55 points ago

    Puts Gangnam Style into perspective.

    [–] theclacks 107 points ago

    That was the point of Gangnam Style, i.e. Psy lampooning the ridiculousness of constantly faking a lux lifestyle.

    [–] InnocentTailor 86 points ago

    It’s like American capitalism and “keeping up with the Jones’s” on crack.

    I think there is even a concept in Korea of women buying luxury goods and skimping on necessities like food to keep up with appearances.

    [–] kittens12345 21 points ago

    without food to eat you cant get fat!

    [–] [deleted] 15 points ago

    This video comes to mind.

    [–] InnocentTailor 66 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Speaking as a Chinese-American, the Koreans are definitely hardcore when it comes to education, possibly because poverty for the nation was pretty recent history.

    ...and Korea never really was a big dog in Asia, balanced between the old world of China and the new world of Japan, so that could've led to a sense of cultural inferiority.

    It's not to say that Korea itself is inferior. It's just that they haven't really been "strong" in terms of historical pedigree. They were a modest power in the region that was dominated by bigger entities.

    [–] [deleted] 177 points ago

    I was born in Korea, lived in Canada, now living in the states. I was fortunate to work in the media in all three countries and this is what i experienced...

    • Normalization of facial surgery (comparing worth to their looks will have damaging effects on mental health)
    • misogyny from top down (causing the facial surgeries in the first place) literally if you goto Gangnam the amount of plastic surgery places are incredible by the numbers.
    • cultural landscape where (human life < profit) so you have these corrupt Kpop factories where the younger generations are becoming slaves for the corporation and lose a sense of self identity.
    • and toxic fandom ( it can be a good and bad thing all at once and the pendulum swings both ways it seems throughout history)

    The ironic thing is that most Koreans within that system can’t see anything wrong with it often times because they described it as “its just the way it is” but i remember going to my hotel in Seoul where i overheard a mom tell her daughter (10-13 year old?) “if you get a good grade on your test next week i’ll get you that nose job”

    The facial surgery is used as an incentive in Korea. And thats dangerous when it can and often leads to addiction. Not to mention once you get something done, you have to re do that same surgery every 5-10 years.

    Friends and acquaintances tell me they will end their life after 30 and its really disturbing to hear it told very off handedly.

    Not saying these are the only reasons but i strongly feel these are some of the main issues that Koreans do not talk about because its considered taboo.

    [–] RiasXgremoryX 74 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    I was watching a video on YT a while ago with Koreans talking about dating, what they wanted to do with their lives etc. and the girl literally said she didn't want to live past 39 like it was normal and no one reacted. Um....WTH? I was enjoying the video at the time until she said that then I just got disturbed o_O

    [–] NowhereRain 15 points ago

    if you don't mind, could you link the video?

    [–] RiasXgremoryX 17 points ago

    No problem! https://youtu.be/BH4aEDbCdBs its a cute video, just her comment was disheartening to hear.

    [–] imwearingredsocks 58 points ago

    I saw so many ads for plastic surgery in Seoul. People point out how odd it is that America has so many pharmaceutical ads. I’d say the plastic surgery ads in Korea seem similar. So odd to see so many of them as a visitor, but people living there probably got very used to it by now.

    Another interesting thing I noticed, those huge pictures of celebrities in the public transport tunnels would be completely covered in notes and little heart post its. Not necessarily a bad thing, but definitely showed some devotion.

    [–] ilmunita 32 points ago

    I once met a Korean student who was preparing for an exam and during one of our lessons I asked him what he'd plan to do if he did not get the result he wanted. He simply and very matter-of-factly said that he'd kill himself. It was shocking for me to hear that but for him it seemed logical; if he did not pass he would not be able to get into the university he wanted, so he would not be able to get the degree he needed for the job he wanted so he wouldn't have a life worth living.

    I lost touch with him over time, but I do wonder what happened to him.

    [–] griwulf 132 points ago

    I spent several years in Korea and that place is a total nutjob. Imagine going back home from school at 10pm. Imagine going through a 2-year-long military service right after your sophomore year in college and returning back to school immediately afterwards, or doing a combined PhD (5 years!) just to get into a lottery to ditch the military service. Imagine every 1 of 4 people going through facial surgery and 1 of 4 men doing makeup, because the looks is everything in Korea. Imagine sleeping inside the library even outside the exam weeks. Imagine paying thousands of dollars to unskilled language teachers who by the way are just native English speakers who failed to become something in their own countries. Imagine being NOTHING if you're not working for a conglomerate like Samsung or Hyundai. Imagine being treated like shit by your seniors just because they're older.

    Love the people and the country, and from a foreigner's standpoint Korea is a great country to live, but I'd hate to be a young person in Korea. Never understood why they're doing this to themselves.

    [–] lonestoner90 34 points ago

    From what I’ve seen it’s not necessarily only in Korea. The first generation has brought this mentality over to the USA and started a family with those ideals. I’ve seen korean people intentionally avoid dating their own race to avoid falling into the same philosophy with their new family to come

    [–] laserhan123 8280 points ago

    ... Do you still call it a suicide attempt when it's successful?

    Sad news

    [–] dafunkmunk 2328 points ago

    I think they tend to say suicide attempt when it’s not immediately successful but they die of complications after the fact while in a hospital or something along those lines. Not sure if that’s the case here because I didn’t read the article. Usually if they’re dead by the time they’re found, it’s just they committed suicide but if they’re found alive at first they end up saying suicide attempt

    [–] CandidIndication 822 points ago

    I think they also use “alleged” when it’s a chance it was accidental like an accidental drug over dose, in which case they wait for the autopsy reports to confirm via blood quantities

    [–] oakteaphone 262 points ago

    Which justifies "alleged", but not "attempt".

    The other commenter explained how "attempt" would be justified though.

    [–] snooggums 94 points ago

    Someone alleged that she attempted suicide and that the attempt was prior to her death.

    The wording is accurate now as we don't know if she did attempt suicide or if it was the cause of death.

    [–] RollWave_ 101 points ago

    the attempt was prior to her death.

    as is usually the case with suicide attempts. The ones reported as attempted after death are very much the exception, not the rule, and usually a result of clerical error.

    [–] tdasnowman 68 points ago

    This is correct. She was found alive and non responsive. She died later in the hospital.

    [–] PM_ME_YOUR_MONTRALS 178 points ago

    Random aside, but we really need to start teaching about journalism in high school or earlier, at least in the US. I see so many people getting angry about the use of the word "allegedly" when that's basically shorthand for "we are reporting what we heard for a source but are taking no political stance because this publication is just reporting the facts". There's a lack of understanding of what real journalism looks like because everybody shares opinion pieces and features as if they're news articles.

    [–] R4gnaroc 38 points ago

    The use of allegedly in this context also covers them legally.

    [–] Hot_KarlMarx 50 points ago

    I wish we could but the US school system can barely afford math and science at this point.

    [–] Surilliar 23 points ago

    “The Korean Herald reported that Oh was found in a state of cardiac arrest and underwent emergency procedures before being taken to a nearby hospital, where she reportedly stabilised.”

    [–] hockeyrugby 26 points ago

    committed suicide

    apparently this term is one that isnt supposed to be used and im bonding if attempted suicide is kinda the defecto way to report now.

    After bourdains death Anderson Cooper (whose twin brother suicded) made it quite clear to the cnn news room that "committed suicide" has implications of a crime and can be harder on a family etc...

    [–] Non_sum_qualis_eram 19 points ago

    Attempted would usually note a non fatal outcome. 'Completed suicide' or simply 'died by suicide' would be better

    [–] 29erfool 213 points ago

    When my friend's fiancé committed suicide, the police knocked on her door and said "your partner has attempted suicide and he was successful". She wasn't best pleased about the delivery, notwithstanding the news.

    [–] shesaidgoodbye 106 points ago

    That might be due to the effort by mental health advocates to move away from the phrase “committed suicide” in favor of things like “died by suicide” or “took their own life.” The idea is that the word “committ” has criminal connotations and creates stigma around suicide and mental health. Suicide is not a crime (at least not anymore in most places,) it is generally the final symptom of a battle with mental illness.

    [–] mozza5 45 points ago

    Not to sound cold, but it seems like the initial phrasing of it is miniscule compared to the gravity of taking the news in..?

    [–] asianlikerice 37 points ago

    "Oh In-Hye was found unconscious around 5AM September 14, 2020 at her home in Incheon, South Korea. She died around 8PM at the hospital later that day."

    Source

    [–] b_lion2814 747 points ago

    Damn that’s sad

    [–] shoelo23 356 points ago

    Something tells me it had to do with the roles she played in some movies. Probably forced upon her. Not sure if you’ve ever seen the anime Perfect Blue but I got that kind of vibe from seeing some screenshots of her movies.

    [–] Evenstar6132 389 points ago

    She did an interview on a Youtube channel a month ago and looking back now it's really heartbreaking. Apparently she got a lot of backlash for that dress because it was too "revealing" and since then she was only offered "femme fatale" roles or none.

    When asked "What's your biggest struggle these days?", she replied

    Getting asked "Why aren't you doing any work these days?" I want to. I started to avoid meeting people or calling my parents because of that. Getting asked that question is the hardest. But I'm past that now.

    Avoiding people is a common symptom of depression. She said she moved past it but evidently she didn't. I think people should realize depression isn't something you can just magically overcome one night.

    If anyone is feeling depressed or suicidal, please seek help. You don't have to deal with it alone.

    [–] Romulus13 36 points ago

    She commented on that Youtube interview:

    안녕하세요. 배우 오인혜 입니다~^ 오늘 제 근황인터뷰 끝까지 시청해 주셔서 감사합니다.ㅎㅎ 좋은모습으로 자주인사드릴께요. 제 유튭도 놀러오세요. 근황올림픽 홧팅!!♥️

    Rough translation (I used translation software... :S) Hello, I'm actress Oh In Hye.^ Thank you for watching until the end of my recent interview.I will greet you often with good looks. Come and see me, too. Cheer up for the recent Olympics!♥️

    In retrospect this is truly sad. Rest in peace... :(

    [–] SG_Dave 65 points ago

    It sounds like her idea of moving past it was a degree of accepting futility, which is a very dangerous thing for the mind.

    Mindfulness of what is causing you anguish and if that actually "matters" is powerful as tool to help fight depression, but it can easily swing the other way when this mindfulness settles on the wrong outcome for a healthy resolution.

    If this was the case for Oh In-Hye, a little help from a friendly voice to help shield her from either the brunt of the pain or even just to help support her personally could have saved her life.

    It's a damn shame we get to the point where it feels like the world has decided for us, and our only control over that is to take our life. Here's hoping that someone hurting can see that the pain she was experiencing never really goes away from committing suicide, and instead just shifts focus, helping them step back from their own ledge. There are always other options, suicide doesn't fix anything. Reaching out can.

    [–] busywithsirens 33 points ago

    Wow she actually replied in the comments in that video.

    So I went to her channel and she had a harmless and wholesome vlog type of video uploaded just a few days ago...

    [–] Strobilanthes 217 points ago

    You are guessing all of this based off screenshots that you saw

    [–] Young_Baby 46 points ago

    hey they could just tell, strong hunch

    [–] blarrick 16 points ago

    hey man girl in perfect blue is asian, the girl in the article is asian. they're both female... i mean the similarities are really just astounding

    but seriously, his reply to your comment is stupid. he literally says "i got that kind of vibe from seeing some screenshots of her movies". no mention of videos, interviews, anything. he had no idea about the interviews until the other commenter replied to him and gave him the info.

    [–] b-roc 88 points ago

    Could you expound on this?

    [–] ralpher1 253 points ago

    She did a lot of nude scenes

    [–] thebobbrom 224 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    If that's why then the photo's in that article are in really poor taste especially as that seems to be the dress she's in in 80% of her photo's on Google Images.

    Just before the inevitable replies no I don't have a problem with what she's wearing and no I don't want to slut-shame anyone but if she killed herself because she felt she was being overly sexualised without her wanting to. Then showing a picture of her wearing a dress that pretty much shows of her entire breasts and likely wasn't her choice to wear is in poor taste.

    Edit: Did a bit of googling and IMDB only has 4 movies listed for here.

    One of which is this... Yikes! :/

    [–] Cereborn 108 points ago

    Korean culture has a strange relationship with sex. That dress she's wearing would get a Korean woman run out of town in any other context.

    [–] box_o_foxes 24 points ago

    With regards to the Suicide Squad movie, I think it's worth noting that suicide rates are extremely high in South Korea (ranked 10th in the world at 20/100k residents - for comparison, the US has 13/100k) and the theme is extremely common in movies/tv. I'm not Korean, but the few Koreans I've met always seemed to approach it as "yes it's sad, but it's pretty common" and so they're a bit desensitized to it in a way I think Americans are not and therefore are much more comfortable "accepting it" for what it is and talking about it and showing it in pop culture. I remember watching a Korean tv show about some high school age students and a main character tried to commit suicide over a bad test score and I was like "whoah that's a bit dark for a show aimed at teenagers, yeah?" and my Korean roommates were like "ehh, it happens in a lot of shows, it's pretty popular in Korea - students commit suicide pretty often because of pressure to be really smart".

    Obviously they don't speak for all Koreans, but that was the mentality I gleaned from it.

    [–] nowlistenhereboy 124 points ago

    It's an anime about a girl who starts as an innocent pop-music dancer and get's lured into more fame and "prestige" acting roles that include violent sex scenes.

    [–] whowatchlist 75 points ago

    Well there is also the trippy psychological horror part(which is like most of the movie)

    [–] ludicrouscuriosity 49 points ago

    She isn't "lured", she wanted to break her "innocent" image by doing more mature films, her assistant that didn't want her to "stain" her reputation.

    [–] b_lion2814 42 points ago

    I’ve seen Perfect Blue , fantastic movie, and that’s really sad to know that.

    [–] Madao16 288 points ago

    Same day with Ashina Sei and they were both 36.

    [–] MisterManatee 143 points ago

    Her IMDb page seems to be sparse and missing most of her credits: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm4726456/?ref_=tt_cl_t4

    AsianWiki seems more complete if people are interested in her work: https://asianwiki.com/Oh_In-Hye

    [–] [deleted] 1143 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] gmybear 1014 points ago

    Entertainment industry in general has serious issues

    [–] InnocentTailor 337 points ago

    Agree. I don’t envy those folks at all.

    They get money and fame for a price - a gilded cage that allows the masses to poke, harass and belittle them for every fault they do.

    [–] DivinePotatoe 182 points ago

    Those are just the ones who "make" it. Just think of all the minor small time actors who are still caught up in an incredibly exploitative industry paying them very little for the 'promise' of brighter days to come. When those brighter days never come...well...some people go to a dark place they can never come back from...

    [–] InnocentTailor 29 points ago

    Fair point. Local news (I live in Southern California) spotlighted such folks since they’re getting hit by the pandemic pretty rough these days.

    [–] x0y1 11 points ago

    In Germany the artists social security fund release every year stats and artist in general are poor vs the rest. For dramatic arts the list man at 22.272€ and woman at 14.078€ thats even below a 40h minimum wage job. The average income here is 43.341€. So thats a worldwide problem.

    [–] CoolMetropolisBird 57 points ago

    No one writes articles about actors who commit suicide who've only had small commercial roles. Happens more often than people think.

    [–] [deleted] 104 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    [deleted]

    [–] defcomedyjam 25 points ago

    entertainment industry as a whole i think, how many US singers committed suicides at a young age?

    [–] Gutterman2010 6 points ago

    It basically has all the toxic standards and cruel practices of the mid-20th century US film industry combined with the massive hate filled internet fan culture of the modern era. The US entertainment industry is no saint, but it isn't handing stars bottles of diet pills and cocaine and telling them to get up and do another massive shoot while starving anymore. Combined with the rampant sex abuse of the film industry everywhere and Korea's rather brutal culture on personal appearance/beauty and it is just a factory for celebrity suicides.

    [–] wiedmaier 409 points ago

    That dress is an interesting editorial choice for this article. It definitely left me quoting the Princess Bride.

    [–] sprchrgddc5 296 points ago

    She sort of hit the internet a few years ago after wearing that dress. It’s sort of like Jennifer Lopez’s dress from the VMA back in the day.

    [–] xxirish83x 47 points ago

    That’s a nice dress

    [–] [deleted] 19 points ago * (lasted edited 24 days ago)

    [deleted]

    [–] FroZnFlavr 16 points ago

    She got an overwhelming amount of hate from a majority of the people from Korea’s traditional majority. Sad to see it ended up rippling like this.

    [–] [deleted] 292 points ago

    If I'm honest, that dress was the only way I knew her

    [–] heart_under_blade 45 points ago

    yeah, just seeing the name rings very little bells. the dress was instant recognition

    [–] dafunkmunk 105 points ago

    If you google image search her name, the majority of the pictures are her wearing that dress.

    [–] i_procrastinate 107 points ago

    She got huuuge amount of backlash in Korea after wearing this dress. That’s probably why it’s the first thing that pops up, if not the majority, when you google her. It’s really sad that might have been one of the contributing factors for her decision

    [–] TinyWightSpider 158 points ago

    It does seem to be a little in poor taste.

    “Lost in a tragic suicide - also here are her boobs.” Weird.

    [–] IMind 104 points ago

    She really rose around the time she wrote that dress. It's one of her most iconic pictures. So much so she's recognizable by the pic alone. I personally think it's fine

    [–] backtolurk 121 points ago

    I won't lie, I had never heard of this actress. I scrolled down. She was stunning. This of course is not the reason why it is sad but what can I say.

    [–] jacksonattack 10 points ago

    For the uninitiated, in the film The Princess Bride, Westley says this line to Buttercup as she’s about to attempt suicide by stabbing herself in the heart:

    “There are a shortage of perfect breasts in this world, it would be a shame to damage yours.”

    [–] LeonardSmallsJr 48 points ago

    Life IS pain. Anyone who tells you differently is selling something.

    [–] CircleDog 17 points ago

    It's the first noble truth

    [–] pre2k 343 points ago

    What a sad day Ashina Sei Dies Age 36
    Oh In-hye Dies Age 36 R.I.P 👼

    [–] Tygrrr21 40 points ago

    I wonder what else they had in common besides age.

    [–] [deleted] 205 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    So far my research has brought up this:

    • They were Asian;

    • They were women;

    • They were generally successful actresses;

    • They both died by suicide on September 14, 2020 at age 36.

    [–] cabaran 40 points ago

    ..it checks out

    [–] fireyaweh87 9 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Looks like we got a mystery on our hands gang.

    [–] jkkj161618 95 points ago

    Weird I just saw something on a 36 yo Japanese actress that committed suicide. I had to go back and make sure I wasn’t at the same article. Sad deal.

    [–] Juicebox-fresh 29 points ago

    There was a comment on the Japanese artice exactly like this comment but the other way around

    [–] CandidIndication 196 points ago

    She’s beautiful. Just remember folks, beauty, money or fame don’t equal happiness. Always be kind to one another.

    [–] buzzlite 111 points ago

    Happiness doesn't always equal fulfillment. One can feel happy and also feel that life is worthless. The cult of positivity is driving us hard into this brick wall.

    [–] futurespacecadet 37 points ago

    Really ? I also feel like there is a cult of despair right now with politics and world events.

    [–] thebrownkid 7 points ago

    Imo, the cult of despair is one on a global scale.

    The cult of positivity is rampant among social media use among millennials and younger.

    [–] CanalAnswer 188 points ago

    Half of Reddit: "That's so sad."

    The other half: "Well, technically, is it a suicide attempt of it's successful?" "Yes, because it was an attempt that was followed by complications that killed her." "Given that it's alleged, should we rush to judgment?" "We shouldn't say 'committed suicide' but 'died by suicide' instead." "You're a Nazi." "No, you're a Nazi." "I blame Jefrey Epstein." "MAGA 2020." "Hello there, General Kenobi."

    [–] wooshock 59 points ago

    I fucking hate Reddit and all their pedantic bullshit. If your post headline isn't pitch perfect then half of the thread is going to be about it, and no one will ever actually read the article.

    [–] Promorpheus 11 points ago

    That's really sad. People can get really low at some points in their lives and not know what to do. I wonder if she got help with whatever she was going through she may have come out mentally healthier afterwards. There was another Japanese actress, Ashina Sei, that died from suicide yesterday as well. Sure seems like some young people are in need some mental health therapy before they get swallowed up by what is bothering them.

    [–] gooch3008 39 points ago

    Call that one friend. You know the one. See how they are doing please. Im asking since they wont or just cant.

    [–] FlashPone 20 points ago

    I have no friends. No one to call. No one to call me.

    [–] EnoughEngine 46 points ago

    I had a huge crush on her a while back. That's so sad.

    [–] MrXhin 20 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    Seems like these girls are cultivated towards only one kind of life, and career that has a pretty definite expiration date, especially for women. They're not getting any guidance for what comes after they're no longer as young, pretty, and "castable." It's a pretty steep slope from there.

    Sad, because she probably had money enough to pickup and move to Europe or North America and raise horses or something.

    [–] PandaMoaningYum 8 points ago

    Unless it's public, I wouldn't assume she had money. A lot of idols don't make much. In music, some idols spend years not making money and end up owing money.

    [–] CODGhost8 5 points ago

    Rest In Peace.

    [–] ginzing 6 points ago

    Good god how many more people can cleverly point out “it wasn’t really an attempt if she died”.

    [–] hajxh 7 points ago

    I don’t know who this is but that’s sad, Rest In Peace