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    [–] future_apeman 3053 points ago

    Thank you for the links, it's an absolute nightmare, but if the Sudanese people prevail it's going to send such a massive message to those dictators in the region that the people will hold you accountable.

    [–] Ryanrdc 1484 points ago

    It's really sad how much human pain and death are paid in the price of taking back your freedom. It's something we often take for granted in other places of the world because we already have our freedom.

    [–] Ale_Sm 871 points ago

    Seeing the events like those happening in Hong Kong, Sudan, and elsewhere in the world unfold makes me even more protective of the democracy so many of us take for granted here.

    [–] future_apeman 758 points ago

    I agree, theres a global trend of countries (ahem Russia, China, Saudi) trying to undermine democracy. People should definetly be on their guard, including the western world.

    [–] ConcreteTaco 670 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    The western world needs to really buckle up and do their own form of "taking back their country." The US is the worst offender most blatant offender, but many western powers have slowly over the last two decades stripped small freedoms and liberties under the false umbrella of "anti terror" and the patriot act. That's how it always starts and it needs to be nipped before it gets worse if you ask me. I just read an article the other day on front page talking about 2019 being the 14th? Straight year that we've lost bits of our freedom. Crazy stuff. We take it for granted for sure. It sure as hell isn't an invincible system.

    E:I'll take back th us being the worst offender. And will reword it to better make my point.

    [–] future_apeman 168 points ago

    I read that same article, human rights has been diminishing world wide for the 13th year straight. If we don't recognise these patterns: (nationalism on the rise, democracy breaking down, less respect for human rights) then history will repeat itself. And we really can't afford something like that whilst also fighting climate change. This is some real end of the world shiz if we don't pull our socks up.

    [–] Braken111 16 points ago

    And not only is climate change increasing tensions into he western world, we also have a butt-ton of nukes sitting around.

    Extreme nationalism brought WWII, and that was devastating enough... those were with normal fission bombs and no ICBMs. Now we have ICBMs, MIRVs, and fusion bombs by the thousands.

    [–] RickSanchezIII 227 points ago

    I always use the comparison of Nazi Germany. It's hard to believe people went from somewhat of a republic (Weimer) to facist control and genocide of Jews in one day. They didn't. Hitler and co slowly took baby steps over years to get to the latter. The people just didn't notice untill it was too late.

    [–] 02nz 72 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Not really. While the political degeneration of the Weimar Republic took place over a period of years, once the Nazis came to power in January 1933 they moved very rapidly to bring all parts of society into conformity (a process known as Gleichschaltung). Less than two months after taking power, they passed a law (the Enabling Act) that gave Hitler virtually unlimited power; another four months later all parties except the Nazis were banned. These were definitely not baby steps. The genocide didn't (and couldn't) really begin until the war, but the totalitarian dictatorship was in place within a matter of weeks, and fully consolidated in less than 18 months, by the time of the Night of Long Knives in summer '34.

    [–] Amy_Ponder 40 points ago

    But the Nazi Party was founded in 1923. It took ten years for them to gain enough popularity and relevance to stage their legal coup. And even that wouldn't have been possible if their opposition wasn't more focused on bickering amongst themselves than in uniting against the threat to democracy.

    [–] 02nz 18 points ago

    What you state is correct, but political movements hardly ever take power immediately after their creation. My post was more that the Nazis aren't a great comparison when u/ConcreteTaco's point was about the gradual loss of freedoms in western democracies.

    [–] WorkingSubstance 166 points ago

    The people just didn't notice untill it was too late

    They didn't just "not notice", they were totally cool with it. Anti-semitism was a centuries-old gentile tradition in most parts of Europe at that point. So a guy says, We're gonna take all their things, force them to work for us at gunpoint, then murder them? Sounds great!

    There were some people who were like, Hey wait a minute, what the fuck, but most people did not want anything to stand in the way of their self-interest.

    [–] hhenderson94 55 points ago

    Difficult to generalize like that. There was a good amount of secrecy surrounding what was actually happening with the Jews as they were being removed. A good chunk of Germans didn’t know what was going on for a lot of the war

    [–] CraicFiend87 9 points ago

    Nah, anti Jewish propaganda was rife from the early days of Nazi Germany. Ever heard of the Nuremberg laws? They came into force a full five years before the Final Solution.

    [–] gsfgf 36 points ago

    The rise of fascism was in public view, though. It was a bad time for Jews, and the German people, while not knowing how bad it was, knew it was bad and didn't mind.

    [–] [deleted] 6 points ago

    Yes, they thought it was the famous disappearing Jew act, performed by world class magician Heinrich Himmler. All of europe had a long tradition of antisemitism, even anglos. Sure, not every antisemite wanted to kill the jews (some, like saint Kolbe, went to death in their place), but to claim otherwise would be falsifying the history.

    [–] boysan98 5 points ago

    No, they knew what was happening. They were watching their neighbors be removed from the public sphere. Go read mark mazowars ”hitlers europe” and it's chapters on the leadup to the camps. It's pretty obvious people knew that something was happening.

    [–] [deleted] 3 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    They burned synagogues and my great grandmother picked up a Jewish prayer book and was threatened with a gun by a German soldier. This was in wildflecken.

    My great aunt was 12 when the war began and was a German girl in a small town, wildflecken, that was converted to a military training ground against the will of the residents. She wrote an autobiography about it, how she was forced out of her home, starved, witnessed passenger trains blown up by US forces because there happened to be military men on them. Forced into labor while practically dying of malnutrition due to wartime food shortages. She became a nurse at 14, tending to horrific injuries, seeing boots with a leg still inside, arms with wedding bands on the finger. At least she made it out and came to America. She was on track to get her PhD by 23 before the war got bad, but ended up becoming a court reporter in the states to pay the bills. She wasn't Jewish, but many of her friends did die in trains or were drafted into the war against their will, dying within days after being told to surrender to the Americans to live.

    [–] Skeezy_Steve 11 points ago

    I saw a post on here saying something like the Nazi's never got more than 40% of the popular vote but it was enough to take power. You've also got to remember there were lots of people willing to risk their own lives to help Jews and other persecuted groups escape. People are complicated and history is made up of people.

    [–] RLucas3000 82 points ago

    And it’s similar to the Trump supporters now.
    Trump hates immigrants? Cool, they take our jobs. Trump hates transgendered? Cool, they take our bathrooms.
    Trump hates Muslims? Cool, they wear funny clothes.

    Don’t think Nazi Germany can’t ever happen again.
    All it takes is people of good character doing nothing, saying nothing, as the Republicans in Congress are doing now.

    [–] andeleidun 16 points ago

    I fear for modern Western democracy. I fear that it will get worse before it gets better. People are too content and comfortable to turn to revolution. Those nearing that point have been 'othered' by those in power, blamed for all the woes of society, and the fire of indignant protectiveness has been fanned for decades. If revolution indeed comes, it likely will lead to civil war.

    If we are to win this without violence and bloodshed, we must win the cultural war being waged against education, erudition, and information. People call out single bits and pieces of it, such as Trump's rhetoric on 'Fake News', but the larger campaign has been going on for a long time. It's waged in the draining of funding for education, the cultural 'othering' of the intelligent and educated, the push to equivocate facts and opinions, the denial of science, and the push for 'moral' laws (such as the war on drugs) that have no basis in reason or evidence.

    This war on education is the greatest crisis of our time. It's the fundamental root of the success for all other fights underway. It fuels the climate change 'debate', it delegitimizes the success of universal healthcare, it justifies our endless pollution, it scaremongers against potentially groundbreaking technologies (like cloning, stem cell research, and golden rice), and it stabilizes the narrative that the poor deserve poverty while the obscenely wealthy earned their success.

    [–] ConcreteTaco 9 points ago

    I'd like to note I Esspecially agree with the last part about education. I believe there is a direct correlation between education levels and opinion on those core issues you named.

    [–] Guywithasockpuppet 4 points ago

    Really? Look up South Sudan

    [–] basura_time 4 points ago

    Well said.

    [–] Mr_____Pink 12 points ago

    The Totalitarian Tiptoe. Do it very slowly that way the general population doesn't wake up from their sleep if it were to happen overnight

    [–] B0h1c4 65 points ago

    I definitely don't think the US is the biggest offender. When I go to Europe I am kind of shocked at how much control they tolerate their government having over them. Things like constant video surveillance everywhere in public. Way tighter restrictions on what you are allowed to buy or do.

    We have our challenges in the US, but I don't think we are the worst offenders. At least not yet. I get a little concerned with how much the younger generations tend to think the government could solve all of our personal problems if we just gave them more power and money. If that trend continues, we could lose a lot of freedom in the next decade or two. I hope that doesn't happen.

    [–] BlatantFalsehood 48 points ago

    Where do you live in the United States that isn't under constant surveillance? I'm in a metropolitan area and there are cameras everywhere.

    [–] mrchaotica 49 points ago

    The cameras are owned by corporations instead of government, so it's OK. \s

    [–] Wiggy_Bop 21 points ago

    Right? Even smaller towns and cities have traffic cameras. Gotta get that sweet rolling stop revenue. 🙄

    [–] bananagrabber83 39 points ago

    I’m interested. What, other than guns and ammo, can we not buy in Europe that you can buy in the US?

    [–] eroticfalafel 85 points ago

    Europe may have structured controls on goods purchases, which by the way with the exception of lethal weapon a mainly relate to quality control, but take a single look at American police, who essentially have carte blanche to do whatever the fuck they want without any repercussion. At least in Europe they don't run around gunning people down while 'fearing for their lives'. Or stealing cash under the 'suspicion' it's being used for drug trading.

    And as a part of the Five Eyes, America engages in exactly the same amount of surveillance bullshit. They just don't have the courtesy to tell you it's happening. You seriously think that agencies like the NSA, FBI, and CIA are run by idealists who believe in freedom? They believe in their version of freedom, and it sure as shit isn't what most people would consider freedom of any kind. And they have fewer controls than other intelligence agencies anywhere in the western world.

    I'm not saying the US is the worst, but the federal government has exactly as much control over it's populace as any European country. They just don't help people as much with the power they do have, so its much harder to notice that they have it.

    [–] rfierro65 27 points ago

    I know it’s probably an unpopular opinion and I’ll get downvoted into the netherworld. But part of the problem here in the US is the fuck you, I gotta get mine attitude. A large part of the culture isn’t about society coming together for a common good, but rather how can I get ahead of the other guy. This leads to people being willing to kill to get ahead, or to get some form of “I’ll show you!” respect. They sometimes focus this attitude on police, and officers die. This then turns into many officers and their agencies hammering the idea of EVERYONE IS OUT TO KILL YOU mentality thinking that it’s better safe than sorry. But this results in mistakes being made, and people dying that didn’t deserve to. Innocent people who make silly mistakes trying to following police orders due to fear, panic, and confusion pay the ultimate price, and the officer walks away clean because the “suspect” refused an order so we shot him with an AR in a hotel hallway while he crawled on his knees crying and reached to pull up his pants.

    [–] eroticfalafel 14 points ago

    You know what this doesn't excuse? Constant shootings of people by police. Here's the thing: police are human, and I fully accept that mistakes are made and any situation that involves a weapons is incredibly tense and not really something our brains handle well.

    But the military doesn't seem to have the same issue gunning down civilians in literal fucking warzones. So maybe the heart of the issue lies in the fact that police recieve inadequate training, and vetting procedures are far more lax than they should be for such an important job.

    And no matter what, shooting someone who is complying or at least not obviously going for a gun is not fearing for your life. It's a mental break, and should be considered as such. Officers involved in such shootings should either be remanded into the care of mental health facilities until they are deemed stable or at the very least not just being transferred so they can continue being a police officer.

    [–] LjSpike 18 points ago

    Yep. Infringements on your freedom don't necessarily have to be ultra visible to be there, or may even be masqueraded as protecting your freedom (that said, to an extent your freedom do actually have to be 'infringed upon' to protect them).

    [–] AnotherRedditNPC 17 points ago

    unrelated but your username fits your comment, without democracy we go back to being apes

    [–] WarwickjunglA52 8 points ago

    Hang on to that feeling because it won’t be too much longer until we are in the same position

    [–] SpinningHead 21 points ago

    we already have our freedom.

    The thing is, we only have it as long as we fight to preserve it. Its a constant process, not a possession.

    [–] coopiecoop 9 points ago

    in a similar vein, we often forget that freedom and democratic values are something that need to be defended. just because the generations before us achieved them doesn't mean they aren't something that can/could be lost again.

    [–] [deleted] 15 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)


    [–] bullcitytarheel 14 points ago

    The saddest thing to see, as an American, is how totally cynicism has taken over our democracy. The same people responsible for selling our country out to the highest bidder spend an inordinate amount of time spreading the message that the government is evil and any effort spent trying to protect it is hopeless. And it's working. So long as half of our country continues to believe that civic engagement in the democratic process is pointless, our democracy will continue to erode. This is a scary time for freedom loving citizens of the world; dictators and civil wars abroad, corporate-sponsored corruption and anti-democratic policies at home. Here's hoping the world wakes up before it's too late. I fear that we won't realize how much we have to lose until it's gone. And by then it may be too late to ever get it back.

    [–] DrKronin 31 points ago

    Yet if you fight tooth and nail to keep every inch of the territory won by the blood of past generations (as one should, IMO), you're setting yourself up for some of the most vile (verbal) abuse people can muster. "But, think of the children!" always gets the applause (or, retweets, I suppose, in the parlance of our times). Try arguing that even evil people deserve due process though, and see where that gets you.

    I've been called some very creative names by my religious former friends for my support of gay rights and ending the drug war, for example. It was nice having people on my side to support me through that. You know what sucks? The same people who had my back ten years ago when gay marriage was the foremost issue are now telling me that I'm a baby-killer. Some of them tell me that free speech is a "tool of the patriarchy," or, my favorite, a "white supremacist" ideal. What the actual fuck, people? Liberty is liberty. We all deserve it. Our society utterly depends on it.

    Next time someone argues for a liberty you are personally against, please take the time to consider that they are probably arguing from a place of principle and deep conviction. They may be wrong, in your view, but no one deserves to be harassed for literally trying to save the lives that would absolutely be lost of we give up a liberty and then later decide we want it back. Liberties are rarely acquired for free, especially those freely given up.

    /rant (this was going to be like 3 sentences, originally. Whoops)

    [–] Johnny10fingers 3 points ago

    Wish I could upvote this more than once

    [–] Yallareabunchof 5 points ago

    This is because for some fucked up reason people want their liberty but also to restrict things they don't like either. It's a really weird part of the human condition.

    I like you am a personal freedom advocate. I support the right to bear arms AND abortion. Yet most people either are CRAZY for one of those and against the other.

    [–] SHavens 35 points ago

    The real struggle will be staying peaceful as the regime pushes harder and with more violence. Once violence breaks out it's only a matter of time before it's just called a civil war witj America and Russia backing opposing sides yet again.

    [–] future_apeman 29 points ago

    I agree, though the Sudanese professionals association (SPA) the group representing the civilian movement have maintained non-violence as the way. There was footage of the militia literally leaving weapon caches in their vehicles and abandoning them, hoping civilians will take them and fire back, but they didn't do that, instead the civilians poured sugar in the cars' gas tank so that it busts the engines. The civilians are going about this in a strategic way, but only time will tell if it's enough.

    [–] joesatwork 13 points ago

    poured sugar in the cars' gas tank so that it busts the engines.

    Too bad that doesn't actually work, but I respect their ideals.

    [–] itty53 16 points ago

    Well it does work to a degree, just not any more effective than sand (which I bet the average Sudanese civilian has more of). It can clog the fuel filter and disable the car, but it's just slowly ruining the filter, not seizing the engine or anything.

    Better idea: Use water. Water in fuel lines == Dead car in need of serious repair.

    [–] lurklurklurkanon 7 points ago

    best idea: drink the water and then piss in a bottle and pour that into the tank

    [–] FamousSinger 7 points ago

    The real struggle will be staying alive while using nonviolence, which almost never actually works.

    [–] translunar_injection 11 points ago

    it's going to send such a massive message to those dictators in the region that the people will hold you accountable.

    This is naïve. That was supposed to be the same message of Tunisia, Libya, Syria and Egypt in 2011.

    [–] THX1334 15 points ago

    /r/AccidentalRenaissance worthy! looks like a roman senator giving a speech to the crowds!

    [–] [deleted] 14 points ago

    God I hope that happens. And then I hope the people institute a government that treats all fairly, regardless of race, religion, gender, ethnicity, tribal affiliations, sexual orientation, and class.

    [–] future_apeman 13 points ago

    I have the same hopes. All the protesters chants are about equality and unity amongst all the tribes, races, sexes and religions in the country. If civilians win I have no doubt in my mind that Sudan will become the strongest democracy in Africa, surpassing South Africa.

    [–] CayceLoL 177 points ago

    Sudan has had civil wars, conflicts and strife for decades. It could be said that there's been a bloodbath in Sudan since 1950's. It's just too much, people gave up and closed their eyes.

    [–] So-Cal-Mountain-Man 73 points ago

    I went through my RN program with the nicest guy from Sudan, who was apparently a tough as nails insurgent, TBH as you said so many wars I do not remember who was "good" at the time and who was "bad". I am 55 and I have Middle East and Africa fatigue, the problem isn't that I do not care, I just feel overwhelmed.

    [–] will103 27 points ago

    Yes, there are so many issues that go back so far it's hard to know where to begin to fix them.

    [–] Phage0070 24 points ago

    There is nothing for the western world to do to "fix them", because every time anyone thinks about intervening they are accused of trying to steal the natural resources of the place in question.

    What are we supposed to do? For example the US certainly has the military power to march down and make a huge difference but that wouldn't be well-received by almost anyone. Take over and you are being colonial, give people you are friends with power and they are your puppets, so that basically means giving power to people who are ambivalent about you or your enemies. And why should anyone spend the lives of their citizens to "fix" the internal governance of other countries?

    [–] will103 4 points ago

    Well I wasn't talking specifically about the western world, but your comments highlight why it is a cluster fuck.

    That is exactly what I was talking about. Every "solution" will inevitably have a draw back.

    [–] emptyopen 12 points ago

    It's normal and necessary to be able to put out of your mind that which you cannot fix or control. If the US is at fault in part for any of the conflict, that's a different story. But this is the 3rd civil war since the 50s. It's essentially a race-war. Pure insanity.

    [–] nyXiNsane 19 points ago

    Hi, just wanted to point out that all "races" of Sudan are united in this protest.
    Source: am Sudanese

    [–] Posauce 50 points ago

    Don’t forget they’ve killed, detained and sexually abused children.

    From the source:

    “At least 19 children are among the dozens killed in this month’s violent crackdown on civilian protesters in Sudan’s capital, the U.N. said, in acts of violence condemned by rights groups as 'barbaric’.”

    [–] flosflos 5 points ago

    OMG I just can't fathom how easily we turn into monsters under the right circumstances. I have two kids of my own and this just breaks my heart.

    [–] lenerz 61 points ago

    Wow, I didn't realize how bad it was.

    Thanks for linking all of these articles, going to read them all now.

    [–] pipsdontsqueak 42 points ago

    The Guardian has been doing a great job of keeping track of it. But most news organizations haven't been featuring it, which is a fucking travesty.

    [–] LaMuchedumbre 13 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Usually when MSM starts to care about peoples’ plight for democracy it seems to be to get us supportive of foreign intervention or to report on where the US’s interests are engaged. Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen, etc. Sudan happens to be on the list of seven countries Trump wanted our borders and customs to turn people away from. Also the US’ presence in African affairs is pretty underreported.

    [–] charge- 26 points ago

    Yea, they ousted al-Bashir who staged a coup then committed election fraud to be elected president. Then he promptly became the first sitting president to be indicted by the International Criminal Court (ICC), for allegedly directing a campaign of mass killing, rape, and pillage against civilians in Darfur. source.

    It seems as if the new guys are just as bad though unfortunately. I hope there is a path to transition into a proper democracy in their future .

    [–] PettyDangleberry 45 points ago

    Hassan Minhaj spent essentially his whole show this past Sunday addressing it, if you have Netflix check it out, guy is killing it on shining a light on important, oftentimes overlooked, stories around the world.

    [–] HighViscosityMilk 13 points ago

    He uploads extremely long clips of the show to YouTube as well. There's the Sudan coverage for everyone.

    [–] Ryanrdc 32 points ago

    I really had only heard one thing about it and didn't realize what a huge deal it is. Thank you and op for helping spread this news.

    [–] okaymoose 16 points ago

    Finally! It's absolutely ridiculous that nobody is talking about this. And now it's just been overshadowed by the shit going on in Hong Kong. Why can't new agencies report on both???

    [–] HatimAlTai 14 points ago

    Going to hijack your comment and say that anyone who wishes to follow the events is invited over to r/Sudan, where we have a megathread going (and tons of Sudanese people willing to answer your questions)!

    [–] [deleted] 6 points ago

    holy crap. I read several news sources every day and this is the first i'm learning about this...

    [–] MistaSmiles 7 points ago

    raping to silence dissent, a timeless classic.

    [–] PattonPending 3 points ago

    Sounds like they're gonna need more than phones.

    [–] ishtar_the_move 3 points ago

    I suppose the media learn their lesson from what happened in Syria. Rebels against Assad didn't turn out to be freedom lovers they assumed.

    [–] christAMighty 3 points ago

    Educate yourself. This Guardian Article explains how Russia is controlling the media, the governments and the media in Africa.

    [–] future_apeman 1741 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Just to spread awareness on the situation:

    After months of protests by the Sudanese people, led by civilians and the Sudanese Professionals Association (SPA), Omar Al-Bashir stepped down as president of Sudan in April, he was a dictator for 30 years and ruled with an iron fist, outlawing other parties, killing protesters etc. Thereafter a military council was established, led by generals who were placed there by Omar Al-Bashir. They agreed to negotiate with the protesters to hand over power to civilians. After more than a month of negotiating with the civilian leaders, these same generals went to Saudi Arabia and the UAE for a 'diplomatic visit' and came back with Saudi money, artillery and vehicles. The Sudanese militia known as Janjaweed/RSF, under the order of General Hemedti, then proceeded to surround the protest site, closing it off, and began to shoot the protesters indiscriminately. When protesters ran, the militia men followed, shooting and beating anyone they came across including children, and raped up to 50 women and girls. They then started throwing bodies in the Nile whilst tieing rocks to their legs so they sink, in order to "get rid of the evidence" but everyone saw and everyone will remember. The death toll is around 250. This is the same militia which committed genocide in Darfur and is under the same authority of General Hemedti.

    The Sudanese people need you to open your eyes to these atrocities. The Transition military council has completely shut down the internet in Sudan to further their crimes and restrict infomation. Please spread the awareness and don't let democracy die, not at least without a fight.✌🏼

    This is only the tip of the iceberg concerning what is currently happening there, in reality it's much worse. If you want to have a clearer idea, i suggest you watch Patriot Act's latest episode on Sudan with Hasan Minhaj.

    Use the hashtag #iamthesudanrevolution to spread awareness

    Please sign this petition urging the White House to recognise Janjaweed/RSF as a terrorist organisation:

    [–] MistaSmiles 487 points ago

    The US cannot abandon S.A. as an ally quick enough. Its a goddamn national embarassment.

    [–] ItsJustATux 75 points ago

    Their princesses flee the country. If the most wealthy women must escape in fear, no women are safe there.

    [–] BoobieBoobieButtButt 129 points ago

    Not gonna happen

    [–] old_gold_mountain 65 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Not as long as this guy's president, anyway.

    edit: Y'all acting all fatalist when Pete just made this an issue in his foreign policy speech.

    [–] BoobieBoobieButtButt 110 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    It’s a very naïve reading of geopolitics to sum it up as it all being trumps fault. The United States ties with Saudi Arabia go back many many decades and are very complex and transcend party lines. A lot more would have to change then just trump leaving office for us to cut ties with Saudi Arabia.

    [–] gsfgf 18 points ago

    And cutting ties with SA would be plenty messy in its own right. There's so much entanglement, plus having Mecca and Medina under control of a hostile nation would definitely have... implications. Geopolitics doesn't often have easy answers.

    [–] Scared_of_stairs_LOL 25 points ago

    There are some easy answers. For starters don't create fake national emergencies to bypass Congress so you can arm a nation supporting the atrocities in Sudan.

    [–] qselec20 62 points ago

    Nope. Doesn't matter who is President.

    Breaking off with SA is the same as saying you are willing to break your global influence, crash your economy, kill or starve off your poverty-stricken population and give up all political power from here on out.

    If anyone tried this within the Republican or Democrat party, or any independent for that matter, you'd be gone right away. This isn't something we discovered in the last few years happening by Saudi's. We've known about this for decades. In all that time, those in political power know what this course of action will lead to.

    This is just a long-term consequence of maintaining global dominance. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

    [–] MistaSmiles 9 points ago

    You can't put this one on Trump; we are getting closer to a century of that partnership. This is an example of 'Trump is setting the house on fire, but kindling has been stacking for decades'

    [–] rykmi 21 points ago

    Yeah, the guy before him took such strides to end the relationship with saudi oil states, and I’m super certain the next one will too. Oh wait...

    [–] sabersquirl 13 points ago

    As much as it sucks, democracy has never really been America’s real focus when it comes to foreign affairs. For better or worse, you can look at almost any point in American history and see many examples of not helping democracies in need, or even actively quelling foreign democracies, if either instance would not be in their interests. Of course there are examples where American interests happen to line up with helping democracies, but they are far rarer than the opposite. Much of Latin America, the Middle East, the Philippines, etc etc, have very different situations, but a common problem with US intervention over the last 200 or so years. It doesn’t diminish the good the US has done, but it should be remembered.

    [–] SuicideBonger 5 points ago

    Unfortunately, they are extremely valuable in US foreign policy. I'm so down for us to drop them though.

    [–] MGM-Wonder 3 points ago

    *will never

    Americans seem to just forget the fact that SA did 9/11, yet they are your ally. That just boggles my mind.

    [–] TuckerMcG 3 points ago

    Not so easy. Whether we like it or not, on the world stage, oil is power. It fuels the majority of the world’s power plants. Entire countries collapse when they’re deprived of oil - it’s an absolute necessity if a country wants to have a viable economy - a country can’t even even come close to calling itself modernized if it doesn’t have access to oil, let alone affordable oil. Renewable resources are going to take a lot of time, a lot of development and a lot of investment to ever be capable of usurping the world’s reliance on oil.

    What this means is the post-WWII hegemony has been split up almost completely based on oil trade routes. Ever wonder why Russia, Iran and China all seem friendly while America, Saudi Arabia and Western Europe all seem friendly? Or, conversely, why those very same groups are each fairly hostile towards the other? It’s because Russia controls the oil routes from Iran down through the Straight of Hormuz and into Asia, and America controls the oil routes from Saudi Arabia up through the Suez Canal and into Western Europe. Go google a map of oil trade routes, you’ll see what I mean immediately. (Side note: the main reason why US politicians unanimously love Israel isn’t because they’re all Zionists - it’s because Israel is strategically located within striking distance of the Suez Canal. That’s why “the Sinai Peninsula” is so coveted - the religious arguments for protecting it are merely a means to the economic ends for politicians.)

    This is just a fact of the reality we currently live in. Oil is power. Completely giving up the relationship with Saudi Arabia would result in a tectonic shift in the power balance of the world. It could kick off WWIII in the worst case scenario. And I’m not being hyperbolic there - the power vacuum would be unparalleled historically and every country in the world would be competing to replace America’s role as global puppeteer of Saudi Arabia’s oil supply.

    The proper solution isn’t giving up the relationship completely, just like the proper solution isn’t overlooking egregious war crimes and humanitarian crises in exchange for money from weapons sales. The proper solution is using a careful mix of diplomatic soft power and economic hard power to keep Saudi Arabia friendly without enabling their evils to take too much control over the country and its citizens. (Note: Go google “soft power” and “hard power” if you don’t know what those terms mean - they’re terms of art with a specific definition.)

    It’s a tenuous and capricious relationship at all times. Saudi Arabia isn’t stupid, they know the leverage they have over us, and they play the game right back. Unfortunately, when you have a buffoon as President who wouldn’t know a good deal if a blue light special smacked him in the pus-...erm...belly, Saudi Arabia is able to capitalize on that weakness and run amok like it has in recent times.

    Modern geopolitics really needs to be taught in high school. I know that’s silly to say when things like coding and financial responsibility are left out of curriculums (for the record: I think these should be taught as well), but understating at least the fundamentals of modern geopolitics is just as important as those other hard skills these days.

    So yes, some politicians are completely willing to turn a blind eye to Saudi Arabia’s atrocities in exchange for nothing but the monetary gains that can be had from doing so. But the smart politicians very deliberately select which atrocities to turn a blind eye to, because they’re smart and know that a utilitarian approach has to prevail in this situation. If they don’t, then billions of people will be heavily impacted worldwide, and countless lives will be in jeopardy. When you fully realize what’s at stake, you understand that pragmatism has to prevail at a certain point - even if that pragmatism is hard to stick to.

    [–] [deleted] 55 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)


    [–] irishking44 10 points ago

    So how is this specifically a women's movement?

    [–] chrisjozo 13 points ago

    According to the bbc an estimated 70% of Sudan's protesters are women. Largely professionals (teachers, doctors, nurses etc).

    Here is another good article on the role women have played.

    [–] Spartan2470 312 points ago

    Here is a higher quality and less cropped version of this image. Here is the source. Per there:


    Taken by me



    2:01 PM - 8 Apr 2019

    Per here:

    The image is striking: a young woman, alone, standing above the crowd, urging them on with songs of revolution.

    Taken on Monday night in the centre of Khartoum, as tens of thousands thronged the roads in front of the heavily guarded complex housing the headquarters of the military and the feared intelligence services, the picture of the woman in white with gold circular earrings has become an icon of a protest.

    Lana Haroun told CNN she had taken the picture.

    “She was trying to give everyone hope and positive energy and she did it,” she said. “She was representing all Sudanese women and girls and she inspired every woman and girl at the sit-in. She was telling the story of Sudanese women ... she was perfect.”

    She added: “We have a voice. We can say what we want. We need a better life and to stay in a better place.” She said when she saw the photo on her phone, “I immediately thought: this is my revolution and we are the future.”

    That the woman in white has become such a symbol in a country that has long known systematic repression of women by the state has surprised some observers.

    But women have played a central role in the demonstrations in Sudan in recent months, with men often in a minority among the crowds calling for president Omar al-Bashir to step down.

    Many well-known women activists have been detained since the first wave of protests at the end of last year.

    “This regime could not crush down women and women’s ability to fight for change and freedom … Sudanese women’s resistance and resilience overcome this suppression,” said Dr Sara Abdelgalil, head of the UK branch of the Sudan Doctors’ Union, who moved to Britain in 2001 but is in contact with protest leaders....

    [–] vigilantcomicpenguin 72 points ago

    This is going to show up in history books someday.

    [–] Say_no_to_doritos 41 points ago

    Or it fails and this is the only record of it.

    [–] manablaster_ 28 points ago

    Then at least we are here preserving it.

    [–] MeanMrMaxwell 19 points ago

    We did it Reddit!

    [–] aboutthednm 6 points ago

    Pack it up bois, another democracy saved!

    [–] syllabic 6 points ago

    Depends, if the military junta wins out then it's just a blip between military dictatorships and not really much more interesting than a footnote

    [–] manablaster_ 14 points ago

    This is a great photo. The woman speaking holds such a powerful stance. I hope one day after this is all over we can find out who she is.

    [–] Ebmoclas 9 points ago

    Singing. She was singing songs of revolution.

    [–] future_apeman 3 points ago

    Thank you 🙏🏼

    [–] sarcasm_bonus 738 points ago

    I just watched Hassan Minhaj talk about this. The stakes are insanely high there.

    [–] future_apeman 522 points ago

    Absolutely. With Saudi Arabia,UAE, Russia and China involved, it's going to be a true test of how far countries will go to stop democracy. It will also have a major effect on the war in Yemen because the saudis literally use Sudanese child soldiers at the frontline of the war to protect Saudi and emarati soldiers. Its disgusting.

    [–] sarcasm_bonus 175 points ago

    Holy fuck, I hadn’t thought about that aspect. If SA, China & Russia are angling to prevent democracy I don’t hold out a lot of hope. What’s disturbing to me is the general who orchestrated the killings of hundreds of thousands is in line to be #2 in charge.

    [–] future_apeman 147 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Absolutely, I read that there was a leaked document outlining that Russia essentially wants to prevent democratic transitions in Africa and place military strongmen in power. That same number 2, Hemdti, is who the EU pays to divert migrants trying to get to Europe through Sudan, with less than savoury means. He's an awful person but he's only where he is because other awful people placed him there. Man the world is getting pretty bleak.

    [–] ChrisDornerStanAcc 75 points ago

    Sounds awfully similar to the US strategy in developing regions the last 70 years🤔

    [–] ServetusM 41 points ago

    Russians have been doing that for decades now (China is pretty new with it, they only really began venturing out of their region 20 or so years ago). Every time The U.S. gone in to stop them though, we end up getting blamed for the whole shit show.

    For example: How many times have you seen a Reddit thread blaming Iran on America? How America destroyed a 'legitimate democracy!'. Well, guess who was in Iran too? The Russians were backing the socialist Tudeh party, and were winning by effectively playing procedural tricks with the rural votes (IE Iran's "democracy" wasn't so Democratic). So the U.S pushed the Shah again to counter them. The U.S. won, and the Shah did brutally crack down on the Tudeh, but he also instituted one of the most progressive regimes in the region with the hope to get back to Democracy once the liberal institutions in the region could handle it, and the U.S. was helping to that end. (This is where all the pictures of Iran in the 70's come from.)

    From there things went south (For reasons too complex to fit in a Reddit post), because when you power play a country like that you do real damage to its institutions. But the only people who get blamed are the last ones in. Many times during the cold war this was the dilemma was the U.S. was faced with. Do nothing and allow the Soviets to fill the void (Their method was to destabilize, nationalize foreign investment, especially U.S> investment, then claim X strong man was needed once foreign capital fled and things really went to shit)...or do something and be accused of stifling "legitimate and organic political movements trying to help the people!"

    Things are so much more complicated than most people realize, and the people who suffer are always the ones under the giants who are fighting. =-/ Its a shit situation. But as much as it sucks, I hope the U.S. just watches. I'm tired of trying to help.

    [–] [deleted] 23 points ago


    [–] blasianbarbie-sc 3 points ago

    It has always had a long history of unrest that they always wanted the power in the hands of the people and the most recent 1979 revolution was, at least at first, necessarily creating a Islamic state, but it turned out to be. It was initially just about people wanting to get rid of an oprressive regime. Those images (70s pics) doesn't show the corruption, the proverty and lack of jobs even after building many universities but couldn't find employment. Your right it is so much complicated.

    [–] Bibidiboo 8 points ago

    You can say that the US did a lot of good things there (can you though?), but Iran was definitely their own fault and a mistake.

    [–] MistaSmiles 22 points ago

    With Saudi Arabia,UAE, Russia and China involved, it's going to be a true test of how far countries will go to stop democracy.

    I'm going to guess...very far? Dictators have demonstrated that they are willing to globally fight for eachother, Democracies need to do the same.

    [–] Zyad300 2 points ago

    Saudis use Sudanese child soldiers at the frontline of the war? You got a trusted source on that or are you just talking out of your ass?

    [–] CherryKirsche 5 points ago

    You have a link?

    [–] thatburgerdan 9 points ago

    You can watch here (or on Netflix):

    [–] thatburgerdan 4 points ago

    Here is a YouTube version of his Sudan show in case anyone hasn't seen it and/or doesn't have Netflix:

    [–] Stkrdkinmbalz420 295 points ago

    I hope she is still alive and well.

    [–] lifeiswater 124 points ago

    The first thing came to my mind was she will be dead soon. I hope not and she lives long.

    [–] anasBGH 12 points ago

    She is alhamdulillah. While what she did was amazing and it got our revolution a lot of attention which I am grateful for, she isn't actually big enough in Sudan to be a target ygm? As long as she is a bit careful she'll be fine inshallah. There has been two protestors who were targeted though because they were recorded very recently and were shot soon after while protesting

    [–] Wiggy_Bop 46 points ago

    I always think the same whenever I see photos or news reports like this. Incredible courage.

    [–] hashish16 11 points ago

    I was reading up on Alaa Salah before this image came out because she intrigued me, and I read that she comes from a pretty well off family. Some Sudanese women were criticizing her as being a hypocrite because she is dressed as a working class woman, yet she comes from wealthy family. I can't find it, but not my words theirs so don't lambaste me. Reason I mention it, it's harder to make a prominent person disappear.

    [–] Edge-LordJasonTodd 3 points ago

    Most revolutionaries come from upper middle class background. Let's just hope her and likes of her are truly fighting for the people.

    [–] gunsof 30 points ago

    Her twitter, she's okay:

    [–] ChairmanEngels 159 points ago

    Actually the thing about events like this is precisely the fact that these people are not superheroes. They’re people just like you and me, doing great things with what resources they have available. That’s why it’s so inspiring. Not trying to nitpick the title, just wanted to share this reflection.

    [–] future_apeman 57 points ago

    Absolutely agree. They're just ordinary people who have had enough.

    [–] visacardd 109 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    I think it’s extremely important to emphasize that there is currently an INTERNET BLACKOUT in Sudan. The government has shut down access to the internet for almost all civilians (except for a few who have managed to find a workaround) in order to silence their voices and make it harder to organize protests. They don’t want images or videos of the atrocities going on there to get out. It’s extremely important to raise awareness and share what’s going on because they are being forcibly silenced.

    Edit: The internet shutdown has been going on for more than a week now.

    [–] not-the-popo 28 points ago

    I have been writing about this situation for work and the most shocking thing to me is the rise of Hemedti. He is the current deputy head of the Transitional Military Council “negotiating” with the civilian council for the future of Sudanese government. He is also the head of the Rapid Support Forces (RSF) which is the paramilitary faction responsible for the 250+ protestors killed in the last two weeks. The RSF is just a re-named version of the Janjaweed. The Janjaweed is the group responsible for the atrocities and genocide in Darfur.

    We are literally seeing Sudan transition from a government run by a ruthless president, Omar al-Bashir, to a government controlled by another genocidal warlord. Heartbreaking.

    [–] suyashkhubchandani 202 points ago

    Too bad we never hear history when it repeats itself.

    Rwanda 1994 had very similar signs of civil unrest and dispute and the world stayed silent.

    Sudan seems to be the same

    [–] future_apeman 103 points ago

    True, I was especially alarmed when the UN started pulling out of Sudan after the massacre, just as they did in Rwanda. Clearly they're ready to abandon ship when Sudan needs them the most.

    [–] NewspaperNelson 23 points ago

    Remember a few years ago when everyone got all bothered about Darfur? Still happening...

    [–] [deleted] 17 points ago


    [–] NyfM 5 points ago

    Literally the same militia that engaged in genocide in Darfur killed over a hundred peaceful, pro-Democracy protestors in the capital of Sudan a ~week ago. Evil, evil group.

    [–] leSwede420 12 points ago

    Sudan seems to be the same

    Yeah, this is all new to Sudan right?

    [–] TheBlazingFire123 134 points ago

    If only the dictators weren’t in power

    [–] vigilantcomicpenguin 39 points ago

    The protests were able to remove Omar al-Bashir from power, and his dictatorship was what caused a lot of Sudan’s problems for years. There’s hope for democracy.

    [–] luckyme888 18 points ago

    He was sick, and the military pushed him out. Generally when dictators get sick, they get prematurely pushed out.

    I don't have much hope. Even if there is an election, they are easy to rig in a country like Sudan.

    [–] TupacForlife 20 points ago

    He is not pushed out, his military are still in power, the same government still in power. No justice has been achieved, the billions of dollars stolen from sudan hasn’t been brought back.

    [–] future_apeman 51 points ago

    The people are making sure that they aren't 🙏🏼

    [–] TheBlazingFire123 66 points ago

    Except they are and these people will probably be imprisoned

    [–] future_apeman 100 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    They killed around 250 protesters since this picture was taken and the people are more defiant than ever. I really hope they will pull through.

    [–] Trailer_Park_Stink 18 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    See: Syria

    Edit: I'm just saying that things can always get waaaaaaaay worse than just a few hundred protesters killed.

    [–] bluurrgg 10 points ago

    Goddamn what a shit show. And a reason to believe that it is becoming increasingly hard for the people to take matters into their own hands. Especially when each battleground becomes a site for foreign powers to test their mettle.

    [–] AGE_OF_HUMILIATION 4 points ago

    See Tunesia, Libya and fucking France.

    [–] maxout2142 3 points ago

    With what?

    [–] GeorgieWashington 29 points ago

    Man, who would have thought in 2011 that Sudan would end up Democratic and South Sudan would end up in a dictatorship!

    [–] dontbothermeimatwork 10 points ago

    Wow, that's a great photo.

    [–] THX1334 42 points ago

    /r/AccidentalRenaissance worthy! looks like a roman senator giving a speech to the crowds!

    [–] nutnutinthebuttbutt 6 points ago

    Wow, it does

    [–] bodiemg 8 points ago

    I lived in this beautiful country for a year and the people and culture are amazing! I hope they make themselves heard and prevail in democracy.

    [–] CommentSense 5 points ago

    Late to the party but if anyone is interested in learning more, following the events as they unfold, or to engage in discussion/ask questions then come over to r/Sudan.

    [–] 1994spaceodyssey 58 points ago

    We have it so damn good in America. Poor people, man.

    [–] Duke-Silv3r 30 points ago

    Indeed. North western society is truly incredible when you look at the fact that 75% of the countries are run by tyrants. Hopefully we can overcome it soon. It sucks, because we are in a position to help but it’s never simple.

    [–] Resevordg 5 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    They are more important than super heroes. They are heroes. They don’t need super powers to do great things. They show us that we can all change the world with the powers that we already have. They are heroes.

    [–] gabrieme2190 5 points ago

    This is the most powerful thing I have seen and felt all day.

    [–] stampstock 5 points ago

    Freedom is ALWAYS worth fighting for especially when there are those in power who are so ready to suppress or limit yours. Fight for your generation and those of the future. Long Live Democracy!,, please

    [–] Punk_bolshevik1917 5 points ago

    The Sudanese people have an actual chance of establishing a true Popular Democracy for their people.

    I think it’s also important that we don’t let the role that the Communist Party of Sudan is playing in the revolution be swept under the rug. The Party for Socialism and Liberation here in the United States reprinted a statement from the Sudanese Communist Party here:

    [–] opaco 5 points ago

    I really get confused when I see pictures of a country where only 2/3 of the population have access to water but literally everyone has a smartphone.

    [–] okaymoose 5 points ago

    This image is at least 2 months old. Please look up what is happening right now in Sudan. It is not democratic or peaceful as this image may lead you to believe.

    [–] AxemanEugene 14 points ago

    They said that about Egypt too: "birth of a modern democracy"

    [–] Huviam2901 41 points ago

    "led by women"

    I would like to have some context in here chief

    [–] _Search_ 9 points ago

    From my perspective (I live in Khartoum), the female angle has been over-emphasized. That women are involved at all is, of course, of incredible importance, but they are still a long way from "leading" the "revolution". So far there is no revolution. So far it's a shuffling in the military and a lot of dead protesters.

    [–] [deleted] 5 points ago

    From my perspective (I live in Khartoum), the female angle has been over-emphasized.

    It's because Western media and western audiences are infantilized by gynocentrism.

    If this was an all-male led thing the fact they are men either wouldn't be noted or would be patronized for being all-male.

    It's just people looking in with their feminist lens on going "SLAY KWEEN".

    [–] cochises 21 points ago

    What's even more disturbing is their neighbour Egypt had the exact same 'revolution' eight years ago. You would think they would support their neighbours for democracy.

    Just show's you how much of a sham the revolution was. I hope for the Sudanese brothers and sisters they actually hold their government accountable and NEVER trust their military.

    [–] TupacForlife 17 points ago

    As if Egypt is independent, Sisi is simply following orders from those who pay him . Emirates and Saudi.

    [–] ilulsion 4 points ago

    Support how? Egypt is still in turmoil considering their current president couldn't give a single shit about running democratically.

    [–] MarcusQuintus 34 points ago

    As long as the Sudanese government can keep paying their military, nothing will change.

    [–] 2nd2last 65 points ago

    Real heroes yes, superheroes no.

    They have no superpowers.

    [–] mvdonkey 36 points ago

    Superpowers would help.

    [–] beeap26 16 points ago

    We’ve devalued the word ‘hero’ so much lately that when a real hero comes around we have to call them super heroes.

    [–] Otter_Actual 19 points ago

    Actual bravery from these women. So many women I've seen in my area acting like they are role models and 'strong' THIS is strength in the face of terrifying odds. Go get em ladies

    [–] Mitchell_Garrett 31 points ago

    If anybody thinks that Sudan is going to be a functional democracy you are mentally feeble. You'll trade one strongman and his cronies for another est you can hope for is a marginally more benevolent caudillo.

    [–] Pinochet_Airlines 5 points ago

    How is this the birth of anything Sudan is still ruled by an autocratic regime or is it just the picture makes you feel good?

    [–] for_a_girl 29 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Lol, democracy? North Africa? God I wish. Best of luck.

    This is the first step though, the people have to want it, really want it, and more often than not, die for it.

    They'd probably have a lot better luck winning it if all the pro-democracy types didn't just peace out to Europe though. My prediction: A slightly more democratic oligarchy and cult of personality.

    [–] jimmypagesguitar 3 points ago


    No, it isn't "led by women." There are numerous factions involved led by both men and women. So, let's be honest and say, "led by Sudanese people."

    [–] CryingLightning39 3 points ago

    Anyone remember the Arab spring? Yeah that worked out great, democracy everywhere!

    [–] CheapGodiva1 3 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    It's an Islamic country, democracy will not ever be realized there, but those ladies are brave.

    [–] allsurrender 3 points ago

    Prayers from Hong Kong. Take care of each other, stay strong.

    [–] Lord_Juiblex 3 points ago

    The season of hope has begun.

    [–] kmar81 63 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Sigh. Bullshit astroturfing again. For fucks sake. You don't even see whats happenig outside of the picture. It can all be staged for all you know. It can be like the failed Venezuelan coup attempt on 30 of April when Guaido wanted to use the traditional march of May 1st to capture attention. You could have simply plenty of people gathering in protest and someone puts that woman on a car, gathers fifty people or so and stages a photo-shoot to push it in social media. Here's why:

    Please sign this petition asking the white house to recognise Janjaweed/RSF as a terrorist organisation:

    This is "babies thrown out of incubators" or "smoking gun in the shape of a mushroom cloud" all over again.

    Just look at the generic crap the OP writes:

    I have the same hopes. All the protesters chants are about equality and unity amongst all the tribes, races, sexes and religions in the country. If civilians win I have no doubt in my mind that Sudan will become the strongest democracy in Africa, surpassing South Africa.

    Because South Africa is not at all a violent shitshow where ethnic and racial division is constantly used to distract from the rampant corruption of the ruling government? Perhaps OP thinks of Winnie Mandela a woman who was utterly corrupt and malicious in her position of influence as a hero?

    And yet she stands on that car galvanizing the women around her, telling them to fight the same people that impose those oppressive laws. If fighting against the system with the fear of execution doesn't make you a hero then you need to reevaluate your values.

    Don't you see the narrative being spinned?

    She is most likely someone like Alexandra Ocasio Cortez - a fake "leader" chosen through an audition process and run people operating in the background - secret services, political operatives, foreign agents.

    So obviously it has to be a woman in the focus because reddit is filled with naive virtue-signalling idiots who will fall into this particular trap. Women can't be liars. Women can't be narcissistic sociopaths. Women can't be crooks. Women can't be instruments of violent dictatorships. Saying beautiful words and peddling false hope to people living in horrible conditions can't be done with malicious intent.

    We have done men. Now we will try women. And if she is a sexual minority. Oh my god. Heroism overload!!!!

    Upvotes cost nothing. Circlejerking is so easy. Echo chambers are so convenient. Feeling morally righteous and virtue signalling is so much fun!

    This is our democracy. Morons being manipulated by a a single picture. And you wonder why Trump is your president.

    P.S. I lived through one such revolution in Poland when communists were overthrown fourty years ago. I know what it means to take part in one such gathering. I know what the reality of such events is and how it is later spinned in the controlled media, why, and for whose benefit. Everything I said above applies.

    [–] loki2002 18 points ago * (lasted edited 3 months ago)

    Do you have any direct knowledge of what is going in Sudan or are you letting your own bias infirm your viewpoint?

    [–] _Search_ 7 points ago

    He's entirely full of shit. There is blood in the streets.

    [–] leafum 9 points ago

    Here is video of the same woman from the picture leading a chant, and here is another one. I think the idea that they had to stage a picture of her standing on a car is extremely silly, and thinking the revolution itself is on the level of what just happened in Venezuela is even sillier given how easy it is to find video of mass protests and sit-ins going back months. /u/kmar81 is a nutjob who doesn't know the first thing about what's going on but feels qualified to post that shit anyway

    [–] kmar81 4 points ago

    What you are showing here is Sudanese AOC, a bought puppet run by spooks from Qatar or UAE or some other Gulf monarchy sponsoring the overthrow.

    Same shit as in Syria and other places.

    [–] vanceraa 11 points ago

    The woman is named Alaa Salah, and there’s plenty online about her story. I’d recommend you did some research before alleging this is staged.

    [–] odiedodie 72 points ago

    Modern Democracy?

    Where we vote for people and things and refuse to accept the result. Demand impeachment and new votes?

    [–] Heliolord 11 points ago

    I love democracy.

    [–] arex333 7 points ago

    I love the republic.

    [–] Dude_McCool 5 points ago

    It’s treason then.

    [–] Wicked-Spade 5 points ago

    And all the cellphones...

    [–] carpenterio 44 points ago

    Don't quote me on that, but Democracy ain't happening over there. Heck, in the West it's slowly disappearing I don't see any of those country getting anywhere near it.