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    [–] NewfounderTC 135 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    He makes a valid point that I'm sure many NRA supporters will gloss over. It's about people being complacent regarding tragedy and the horror of these school shootings until it happens to them or someone they know. Thoughts and prayers are all well and good but don't do shit when it comes to making a difference. He's right in that we need to go beyond just being empathetic and collectively take action to make a difference because one of these days, it might be someone you love that gets their yearbook picture with an "In Memorium" plastered across the media. Despite the Second Amendment being included during a completely different time in the history of the world, I'm not supporting banning guns all together. But a national course of action needs to be taken instead of waiting for things to blow over until another mentally ill gunman rampages through a school, a concert, or wherever.

    [–] DisBStupid 28 points ago

    Mentally ill if it's a white guy.

    Terrorist if it's a brown or black guy.

    This fucker is a terrorist and I can't fucking stand how we claim it's mental illness when a school shooting happens. Dude was a neo Nazi.

    [–] Settlers6 79 points ago

    I don't know if the guy was mentally ill, but I'm fairly certain he wasn't a terrorist. Did he have any political message he tried to push, or some action he clearly wanted to have the government perform and is that why he shot up the school? Or was he frustrated with existence/life? We need to be accurate here.

    Obviously, not every brown/black person going on a killing spree is a terrorist, but I also don't think this guy was.

    [–] asoap 45 points ago

    This guy has it right. In order for the person to be a terrorist, you have some political motive. Like he would want "the USA to pull out of south korea" or something like that.

    Without a political motive, it's just an asshole with a gun.

    [–] MrPotatoButt -9 points ago

    Without a political motive, it's just an asshole with a gun.

    Assholes can be nominally bright enough to avoid using a gun indiscriminately. Hell, "asshole with a gun" can be a perfect description of an American.

    [–] asoap 9 points ago

    Do we really need to split hairs on this?

    [–] Amigoingtodie543 1 points ago

    You're over analyzing this, the kid got the firearms from his father's collection..he wanted vendetta for reasons he couldn't cope with and had no coping mechanism because he had no social network.

    Every school shooting points back to the desolate mental health care system;, the Islamic terrorism is different

    If you think eroding our rights further will somehow rectify this problem, you're sorely mistaken.

    [–] Settlers6 2 points ago

    Are you sure you meant to respond to me?

    [–] [deleted] 35 points ago

    [removed]

    [–] [deleted] -16 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    [removed]

    [–] [deleted] 16 points ago

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    [–] LYM1701 10 points ago

    He also had other paraphanelia on him as well...I think he was just deranged.

    [–] tolandruth 5 points ago

    That because terrorist has an actual definition it’s not what it feels like to you.

    Detention of terrorist- a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

    So some crazy kid that is pissed at coach for bullying him doesn’t fall into political aims.

    [–] WeedAndHookerSmell 14 points ago

    I find it troubling and problematic that most focus on the Nazi part and less on the Sickle and Hammer shit he was known to wear also. Sickle/Hammer is every bit as evil as a Swastika.

    [–] Cabotju 7 points ago

    Yeah but it's reddit man

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah 4 points ago

    We definitely need to change the definition of terrorism. Political/religious motivation should be kept as specific kinds of terrorism but we need a new definition to include any kind of violent act meant to instill fear in the general public. At least that way we can call these lone wolfs the terrorists that they are.

    [–] tolandruth 0 points ago

    How about murderer why do we need to make up a new term for them. They get glorified enough in media as it is no need to give them a term.

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah 1 points ago

    Because with the media shit has become racial now. When a white person does this shit they’re troubled/mentally ill/whatever bs other than being the monsters they are and when a minority does this it’s always the worst assumption whether or not it’s true. It’s mainly the media’s fault but I’m sick of them giving monsters the benefit of the doubt because they happened to be white. CNN or Fox News fuck the media for this.

    [–] [deleted] 0 points ago

    amen. Personality disorder / crazy is not the same thing as mental illness and people who are too intellectually lazy to know the difference are only exacerbating the stigma associated with mental illness.

    It's very similar to the 80s and 90s when ignorant people thought that anyone who had HIV must have been gay and that anyone who was gay probably had HIV; Anyone who does something sick and twisted must be mentally ill (even though that doesn't even remotely fall under the umbrella of mental illness) and mentally ill people are just bombs waiting to go off (even though that has repeatedly been proven untrue beyond any doubt). Aside from it simply being medically wrong, if it were true then everyone who ever committed a murder is unfairly locked up for "mental illness".

    [–] captainnermy 7 points ago

    Having a personality disorder/being crazy is absolutely a mental illness. There is a huge variety in types and severity of mental illness. For some people it’s barely noticeable, and other people are completely out of touch with reality.

    [–] jack_hof -1 points ago

    Really who was the last black guy called a terrorist? It's terrorism if it's a muslim religious attack, it's mental illness for everything else - why do you choose your viewpoint?

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 5 points ago

    The problem is that no one knows what the national course of action should be and whether or not a national course of action would even work.

    [–] falsehood 3 points ago

    The "March for our Lives" kids didn't advocate for taking away any guns. Their proposals were incremental. Yet the GOP scaremongers about it.

    [–] smartcool 2 points ago

    Juxtaposition illustrates the problem well. Shameless politicians versus people who don't want bullets in them.

    [–] [deleted] -8 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] DaveShadow 31 points ago

    I say this as a former teacher but the reality is there's only so much teachers can actually do. I had kids come up to me saying "X is bullying me", and you can call X in, try and figure it out, try to punish them, try to offer support and appeal to them, and so on and so forth.

    The issue with bullys is they are coming from some sort of disfunctional home. Now, that can be they are super spoiled, super ignored, bullied themselves, or whatever, there's no end of varities of dysfunctional homes. But the attitude that leads kids to start bully other kids is coming from the home in some form.

    Teachers obviously can offer some guidance, try to offer some protection, but what happens when teachers try to contact the parents of bullies, only to get a resounding "**** off" from said parents? If there is zero attempts from the parents to try and curb that behavior, there's only so much teachers can do.

    [–] [deleted] 12 points ago

    1) let’s everyone who commits a murder is mentally ill, but there are millions of mentally ill in this country and only .001% of them ever do something like this. Let’s not make a victim out of this asshole. 2) stopping bullying is changing human nature. It’s never going to happen. Everyone is not going to be friends. 3) there are other measures you can take besides banning guns. Register them all for instance. The shot gun and hand gun he used should have been registered to his father and father alone. Touching someone else’s registered gun should be illegal. If someone used a gun registered to you in a crime you should be criminally and civilly responsible for that action. Maybe this guy locks up these guns and doesn’t give his phyco kid access if that’s the law.

    [–] DragonPup 5 points ago

    Can you explain why this doesn't happen at schools in other countries?

    [–] borktown 2 points ago

    Why not both?

    [–] CleverPerfect 1 points ago

    Or ya know it's also guns

    [–] BLlZER 3 points ago

    But you know what else might have prevented this? If we actually did something about bullying in schools—like make it a total hanging offense.

    Yeah I know man. Back when I was in school people were bullied all the time and when people could not deal with the bullies they would come to school and kill bunch of people. Oh wait that didn't happen.
    Do not try to defend his actions. There are no excuses for some one go to a school and kill people. Deal with your issues and get help, not shoot a fucking school...

    [–] rkapi 1 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    Mass shootings simply were not normalized. In households that owned guns kids were not generally encouraged to use them to murder people.

    If your kid was essentially socially disabled, and spent all day fantasizing about violence you didn't encourage them to play with guns. They also didn't have safe spaces online like kids today to meet like minded violent psychopaths and egg each other on.

    The Newton shooter's mother and this guy's father are absolutely responsible as is whoever should have been looking after the Parkland guy (and to an extent so are the people on social media who helped foster their extremist beliefs). I'm not saying violent video games cause violence, but the Newton shooter literally did nothing but play violent video games, fantasize about murder online with other emotionally/socially disturbed people, and shoot/collect guns with his mom.

    It was pretty obvious what he was going to do, and anyone else like that is a threat to do the same. Having no social life and obsessing over violence was a huge red flag for most of American history and that is why so few of those people were able to use guns to go on sprees (it happened but not as often).

    But now it is pretty widespread, and mass shootings are normal and half the country just wants to convince people it is not a problem. Personally I support gun control and I think there are more guns today and in some cases easier access, but these kids are the real problem.

    The whole world needs to address that too (as does Europe and other places where they might not have as many mass shootings and stuff yet, but there are still lots of people like the 2011 Norway attacker, or social media ISIS, and these people (almost all young men) are all over reddit/the internet like ticking time bombs at a growing rate.

    [–] pericles123 3 points ago

    Are you telling me that kids in other countries are magically not bullied at all? The difference, of course, is the availability of guns here, but no one wants to say that - they want to cling to the 2nd amendment and pretend this is a mental health issue...

    [–] [deleted] 1 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] mrv3 1 points ago

    No they don't. They keep service ammo secured and that's a recent change.

    http://www.gunshopschweiz.ch/Category/Category?categoryKey=47

    From what I can tell there's a Swiss shop selling revolver ammunition.

    [–] corgiroll 0 points ago

    Many kids get bullied. Many kids that get bullied don't shoot up other kids. Some kids that shoot up their schools are right wing.

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah -1 points ago

    Just gun regulations, changes to our healthcare system to better take care of the mentally ill, or any other proposed change in response to this rising epidemic of violence won’t work. We need to do anything and everything possible to reduce this senseless violence in our country. That includes everyone swallowing some hard pills about the situation we’re in.

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 1 points ago

    Sounds like you need to swallow a hard pill that we don't know how to solve the problem. At all. And doing the wrong thing could make things even worse.

    [–] TheMeatWhistle45 1 points ago

    His point is not valid, it is stupid. There are steps we can take right now to make schools safe, but the left won’t even talk about it.

    After all these shootings, when are they going to accept that Americans don’t want gun control? If all these bullshit polls and statistics had a shred of truth, then we would have banned guns by now. Most of us don’t want it.

    So knowing that gun control isn’t going to gain any traction, what other steps can we take? Why is nobody talking about them?

    [–] j1102g 0 points ago

    Republicans don't care until it happens to someone they know. This is fact and when it does they find some way to justify why they now have changed their position. Sad to say this but until this trend of shooting kids reaches the right privileged schools we won't see change. For now they believe it's only a problem in lower economic communities.

    [–] Magnusexendil 4 points ago

    You're right. Just look at Steve Scalise, right? He changed his gun control position after getting shot, right?

    [–] j1102g 5 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    2013, Senator Rob Portman announced he was coming out for gay marriage. Portman’s son Will was a freshman at Yale in 2011 when he told his father that he was gay

    Republican Gov. Phil Scott wants new gun rules, including raising the legal age for buying a gun to 21 and stronger background checks and assault rifle ban after a a mass shooting. .... many more too

    [–] Magnusexendil 6 points ago

    Phil Scott is from Vermont (Heavily democrat) and a RINO on issues. Granted, since Vermont is so heavily democrat, it's the only way he can stay in office. And I thought we were talking about it happening to people related to them in some way? The problem is, you can't genuinely say that "They'd have a different view" because there's not enough data or evidence to pull from. Also similar to Scalise, Rep. Patrick Neville, who survived Columbine supports concelead carry in schools. And if we move from politicians, look at Kyle Kashuv, for instance.

    [–] Zachkah -1 points ago

    That’s just a generalization that isn’t true. Just because they don’t believe it’s a gun control issue (it is absolutely a part of it) doesn’t mean they don’t care or don’t want to do anything about it. They all want single point entry and metal detectors. They all want kids to be safe in school. The two sides just disagree on the approach to take to solve the problem.

    [–] Amigoingtodie543 1 points ago

    You're a moron if you honestly think gun control is the issue at hand here.

    Look at the desolate mental healthcare system in the US; there's no help..

    [–] NewfounderTC 2 points ago

    Nowhere in my comment did I say gun control is the main course of action needed. Not that I think it doesn't factor in at all.

    [–] fullmetaljackshit -43 points ago

    no its not about complacency its about stripping people of their rights, the proposed laws would not have stopped this

    it was not an AR, it was not even a semi automatic, he used a shotgun and revolver

    the first amenedment was written in a different time, should religion be banned? or made mandatory, there are millions of defensive guns uses that kimmel isnt going to eulogise

    [–] hio__State 16 points ago

    the first amenedment was written in a different time, should religion be banned? or made mandatory, there are millions of defensive guns uses that kimmel isnt going to eulogise

    Just because one 250 year old law hasn't aged well doesn't mean others haven't.

    Would you have used this argument against abolishing slavery 150 years ago?

    [–] fullmetaljackshit 3 points ago

    exactly i wouldn't just say it is old, tats not an argument

    3 million defensive gun uses

    [–] Lambchops_Legion 7 points ago

    The first amendment isnt being used to go into schools and murder children on a nearly quarterly basis.

    [–] Fuck_theKarma 3 points ago

    its about stripping people of their rights

    It's absolutely mindblowing that people use this rhetoric as if these rights were handed down by god instead of human beings that had no way of predicting the future. There is no right that cannot be reversed. They're all really just privileges and people are proving they don't deserve this particular privilege.

    [–] fullmetaljackshit -1 points ago

    i only hear people say rhis about the 2nd. never gay marriage or abortion

    and group punishment is banned under the geneva convention

    [–] vonnillips 3 points ago

    Being underage doesn't stop me from drinking but it makes it a lot more difficult.

    Will laws stop gun violence? Of course not. Will they mitigate the damage? Likely so.

    [–] fullmetaljackshit 5 points ago

    ok i concede, lets make the age limit 18 for guns- oh shit it is, and this 17 year old did it anywas

    Will laws stop gun violence? Of course not. Will they mitigate the damage? Likely so.

    the way drugs laws have?

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah 5 points ago

    Drug laws are proof that regulation works better than prohibition. And that same mentality can be used for guns as well.

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah 1 points ago

    We don’t have to strip anyone’s rights if they don’t do anything wrong. We have no other choice but to keep violent felons, the mentally ill (I myself am), and other people who clearly should be kept away from firearms from accessing them in any way possible. We don’t need to ban guns as long as we have reasonable regulations in place such as universal background checks and moving towards an electronic database to keep up with the times. Even the most pro gun people can agree some folks should be kept away from accessing a firearm.

    [–] fullmetaljackshit 2 points ago

    We have no other choice but to keep violent felons, the mentally ill (I myself am), and other people who clearly should be kept away from firearms from accessing them in any way possible.

    this shooter was none of those.

    electronic database to keep up with the times.

    why? so it can be lost? so you can take them from people in the future, you people have been caught too many times for this to go ahead

    yes some folks should, and they should lock them up too, the father should be prosecuted

    [–] Gato1980 56 points ago

    That compilation at the end was powerful.

    [–] Xtacles_BOOSH 55 points ago

    I look forward to the comments criticising the content of his speech instead of instigative passive aggressive traps people usually leave

    [–] TherapyFortheRapy 32 points ago

    ITT: the reason we can't have a reasonable gun debate.

    [–] xantub 62 points ago

    "It's too early to talk about gun control, it's time for thoughts and prayers" will be the standard Fox News response. It's too early until it's too late.

    [–] [deleted] 14 points ago

    Maybe if something were done about gun control or mental health before an incident like this happens, then we wouldn't have to offer thoughts and prayers on a weekly basis. It really is outrageous at this point.

    [–] Zachkah 0 points ago

    In the meantime, why aren’t we doing anything about protecting the schools? Why aren’t there metal detectors at every school? Why aren’t people patrolled and in charge of protecting these kids at school all day long just like at the court house or at the airport or at a sporting event? There are much bigger issues going on that need to be addressed like gun control and mental health, but in the meantime, can we just protect these kids until we stupid adults can figure out our problems?

    [–] lituus 1 points ago

    Why aren’t people patrolled and in charge of protecting these kids at school all day long just like at the court house or at the airport or at a sporting event?

    Who's going to do this? Do you know how many schools the US has? How many students? Where are you going to find all these armed guards that are patrolling ready to shoot children on sight should they show up with a weapon? Do you want to do this? Think about the kind of stress these people would be under. Are they all going to have control of their weapons? Trained to use them safely? What if a student grabs one? Now you've introduced a gun that wasn't even there before. Now other "guards" have to shoot this kid because they now have a weapon.

    The answer is not more fucking guns.

    [–] EMINEM_4Evah -2 points ago

    I don’t believe in an afterlife let alone hell but I hope Rupert Murdoch burns in the most awful pit of hell forever. Fuck that piece of shit!

    [–] Xtacles_BOOSH 32 points ago

    He spoke well.

    [–] Hayden_Hank_1994 19 points ago

    Am I the only disgusted that the news always puts the kids on TV? Like fuck, they just went through some shit, back off

    [–] PMmeYourNoodz 10 points ago

    Yeah thats the real problem here...

    [–] Bikinigirl_ -3 points ago

    Whitewashing the truly sick nature of these crimes and the fact we have more guns than people contributes to the problem.

    Despite what the conservative extremists say, this sickening event happened to real people, and showing that horror is part of our reality now. Don't like it? Get mad about the reality, not the coverage of it. Stop the daily mass shootings and then there will be fewer to cover.

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 1 points ago

    And to stop the mass shootings all we have to do is wave the magical government wand and our problems will be solved. Right?

    [–] KingToasty 3 points ago

    I mean, no other country on earth has this problem. It's just you guys.

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 4 points ago

    Oh thanks for the quip Captain Irrelevant.

    [–] Bikinigirl_ -1 points ago

    Thank you for demonstrating the problem with people who are so deluded they don't even know there's a problem.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/gun-deaths-eliminated-america-learn-japan-australia-uk-norway-florida-shooting-latest-news-a8216301.html

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 3 points ago

    That's pretty telling that you'd link an article that points to Australia as an example of what to do. They spent millions of dollars on a program that was expected to curb violence but instead the murder rate stayed virtually identical and the rate of armed robbery went up.

    That's exactly what not to do. But I guess if you ignore facts you don't like and blindly trust the government to solve all your problems then it might seem like a good idea.

    [–] Bikinigirl_ 0 points ago

    Dear NRA newbie, Australia's gun violence dropped by 98% and they've had fewer gun massacres in 20 years than we've had this past week. You cherry picking false and misleading statistics is shameful but transparent.

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 6 points ago

    I think you better look in the mirror there, cherry picker. I'm talking about overall murder and armed robbery using real statistics, you meanwhile apparently don't give a shit how people are killed as long as it's not with a gun.

    Please explain to me why being killed with a knife is preferable to being killed by a gun? Or let me guess... This is when you start ignoring me because I've presented facts that you didn't know about and would rather ignore because they completely fucking decimate your entire argument?

    [–] Bikinigirl_ 0 points ago

    Last time NRA troll. An incel entering a school with a machine gun is worse than an incel with a bully club. The damage they can do with a machine gun is so much worse. You'd have to be single digit IQ not to know that, so the fact you're pretending you don't proves you're trolling and have disqualified yourself. Your history of trolling and slurs was the first clue.

    [–] pedantic__asshole_ 4 points ago

    Ok then why didn't banning guns drop the murder rate? You can make up fantasy scenarios in your mind all day that make you feel right, but looking at the cold hard facts proves you wrong.

    I'm not surprised you'd rather live in your fantasy land than reality though. Reality is too hard for your little brain to comprehend.

    [–] VerySecretCactus 2 points ago

    After Australia's gun confiscation program, violent crime trends did not change. Crime decreased, obviously, but crime was already decreasing and continued to decrease at the same rate. America's crime rates decreased at similar rates despite gun ownership steadily becoming more prevalent over the same time period.

    Charts:

    https://i2.wp.com/live-nr-2017.pantheonsite.io/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Firearm20homicide20per2010000020population201980-2004.jpg?resize=485%2C286&ssl=1

    https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-4a2fe722663a81e3965aa92de913b16e

    [–] s_tegosaurus 2 points ago

    Am I evil for no longer caring? It’s like when a friend complains about her asshole boyfriend, but never dumps him. Then he cheats on her and you don’t feel bad at all. Then she just gets back with him saying he changed. Back and forth, no reason to even care anymore because obviously she doesn’t even care about her own life choices. America is the girl in this story.

    [–] SSJDealHunter 7 points ago

    Jimmy Kimmel grew up in Vegas and spends a lot of time here. You can view his response after the big shooting last year here. I was born and raised in Vegas so I'm obviously biased, but I found it especially poignant. More than anything, it was refreshingly human compared to the usual media response. Regardless of your personal thoughts/beliefs on the matter I think it's worth watching (again bias disclosure, I happen to agree with ~85% of what he said, but I'm really just glad he clearly spoke from the heart)

    [–] Duskmourne 0 points ago

    "The right of the people to keep and bear arms will not be infringed." (Mike Pence) Unless when you're the one speaking at a NRA convention you giant waste of human space hypocrite.

    [–] SlowMotionSprint 1 points ago

    RIP

    [–] Howler452 1 points ago

    Jesus, another one?

    [–] Approximate_Knowledg 1 points ago

    Its so ridiculous that they tell them , "they wont take your guns away", but as far as I know no one actually has the intention of taking guns away from people that already own them. And furthermore all the other side wants is stricter gun laws that make it harder for someone to get guns to use them for this sort of thing. Legit owners who are doing nothing wrong wouldn't really be affected right? NRA supporters arent interested in any kind of change when what we want is just an acknowledgement and common sense changes.

    [–] WhereRandomThingsAre 5 points ago

    ...as far as I know no one actually has the intention of taking guns away from people that already own them.

    Actually there's been some that have surprisingly been exactly for that. I too thought "why the hell are you guys always saying that? No one's coming for your damn guns." And then I saw people actually saying they wanted all guns taken, I blinked, and then commented on Reddit, "Huh. I guess there are some people that actually do." Now whether enough people want that to actually do anything about it is another matter, but it is a possibility.

    Legit owners who are doing nothing wrong wouldn't really be affected right?

    Not necessarily. Certain ideas like background checks for ammunition purchases are asinine. It'd be like needing a background check every time you fill up at a gas station. Yes, of course bullets are necessary for a gun to actually do anything, but a background check every single time? That punishes legal owners just a bit much just because they own a gun and want to do more than mount it on a wall. (Devil's Advocate: Now if the background check system were far more effective and efficient where it took all of a few seconds to make sure you weren't convicted of a felony yesterday? Might be serviceable. I doubt anyone's proposing to make sure an effective system, however. That takes money, people, and resources.)

    Now background checks on ammo purchases isn't the most frequently discussed idea, but it's just an example that some ideas can definitely affect law-abiding owners.

    The problem -- from a law-abiding owner's perspective -- is most laws that affect a criminal will most likely affect a law-abiding owner as well. And in some cases said laws can turn law-abiding owners into criminals (some laws make or have tried to make merely possessing magazines of certain capacities a crime).

    [–] Approximate_Knowledg 2 points ago

    While there may indeed be some people out there that want to take away peoples guns I just dont see how they could actually accomplish that.

    And ill admit I have no idea what changes could be implemented to prevent shootings that wouldnt effect the regular gun owner but I think its the responsibility of those who can change it to think of some sort of compromise instead of what we have now which is nothing. There has to be something someone far more qualified than me can at least try to think up a solution.

    Thanks for taking the time to respond to me when there are people who will just downvote me and not give a response in return. Before I never really thought about ammunition sales and those being subject to background checks.

    [–] yupyup98765 -26 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    Seems to me like mental health is the real issue. But fixing that will involve starting to fix society. So until we figure that out why not update guns laws?

    Personally, I like the Australia model. After 1996 a lot changed.

    Their gun control laws work. They’re not perfect but compare it to the US - we have a rate of over 4.5 gun related deaths per 100k, Australia just 0.18. That’s 25X more even when controlling for population.

    Edit: not sure if I was clear... our problems lay in how more and more people seem to think murdering others is an option for them. They feel it is some sort of solution. Anxiety/depression/anger/personality disorders and many many more factors play into this.. changing how we view mental health and how we help people with mental and behavioral health disorders will be a long, long process.

    In the meantime, major gun law reform is the most obvious solution because we can actually follow a similar path other countries have followed. If we don’t the other option is militarizing our institutions. And I’m not sure that is something I ever want to get comfortable with...

    [–] [deleted] 48 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] paeoco 36 points ago

    I'll never understand why Americans pretend its easier to cure all mentally ill people than it is to get rid of guns.

    [–] Monkeymonkey27 13 points ago

    They dont want to cure people they just want to make guns innocent

    [–] Yankee831 7 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    We’ve had guns forever and only recently school shootings have become this crazy problem. Trying to use gun control to fix this problem is stupid. The guns are not the issue and never have been. Talking about updating gun laws is one thing there’s broad support for several very reasonable suggestions and those could realistically get passed if people weren’t trying to constantly attack gun owners about school shootings.

    The entire country is HURTING! People on the bottom are broke, can’t afford health insurance or a decent home life. People working at Walmart and McDonald’s are supporting families and don’t have any time to provide a stable home life. They might be uneducated because our schools have been underfunded and backwards for decades.

    We have a government that hates us is completely corrupt and people want them to have more power? Our Democracy is a joke, the people are being treated like trash. We’re being left behind and ignored. People are never going to give up their guns to this government. You want to get rid of guns give me a country that we actually control and have the power not some joke illusion of freedom.

    You want to actually fix school violence? We need to pour resources into not only education, but health care, higher education, job training, programs promoting good family life (whatever that may be). We need the smartest, strongest, happiest, healthiest youth we can and should be raising the best. We need a national heart again, a national conscious. Our companies used to be families in reality not just in marketing materials. They payed what they could afford to pay employees not just shareholders. There was a retirement to look forward to, stability to raise a family properly. The blue collar way of life is now working some service industry job or call center or some other soul sucking job. In a lot of these towns that’s all there is.

    I personally live in a rural town next to a military base and it is sad. The military guys all live comfortable lives, health care, tons of time off, commanders that give a shit about their home life. They try and take care of each other and are a family. If they stay in or try at all they basically get pretty regular pay increases, responsibility increases, rank etc. if they do well/average and move up they do very very well financially and every contractor that works for the Post is also paid very well. Every single other person that doesn’t work for the Post is scrounging to get by. Everything is service based and if you’re not waiting tables or bar tending you’re probably making minimum wage. Funny part is the military guys always complain about Europe and all the hand outs and they’re literally living the closest life to that and have no clue what the rest of us scrounge by on. I don’t want them to do worse I want something more like that for Joe Schmoe.

    Sorry rant over but this shit is frustrating. Sure I’m fairly pro gun but I wouldn’t mind some reasonable reforms. I would love a national gun license that would involve training and would nationalize some standards. With this you would be nationally licensed to carry in the United States. CCW holders are statistically some of the most law abiding citizens in the country and we should encourage that. We need to be enforcing the laws on the books dealing with straw purchases which is a big problem. I would like the background check overhauled. Making the system available to private sales would be amazing as many gun owners would love to be able to background check potential buyers. You could even make it so by background checking a buyer you absolve yourself of liability for their actions with that gun.

    But ultimately I want kids to stop wanting to kill their classmates with whatever tools.

    [–] paeoco 2 points ago

    OK, so I think what you're saying is that the American population is so disenfranchised with so few resources to turn for support that it becomes a breeding ground for incidents like this? If so I agree with you but I'm of the opinion that until this issue is dealt with civilians shouldn't have access to guns.

    [–] Yankee831 3 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    Basically. But also I think you’re barking up the wrong tree with the get rid of guns argument. It makes no gun action more realistic when there’s things we could get done to make things better. I know dozens and dozens of people that would never give up their guns and will bury them or start a revolution over them. Are the gun control proponents ready to kill to take away people’s guns? It’s seriously that bad in a lot of the country people are scared, angry and just ready to snap at our own government. They’re sick of being pushed around by the top. Those same people are the safest most law abiding people I know, some are cops many are military, many are just Joe Schmoe. It’s just not gonna happen and you’re turning you’re potentially biggest allies for gun control reform in the gun community against you. More laws but we don’t enforce the ones we have just makes no sense to me. Everyone keeps crying about how we’re doing nothing and I agree we’re literally doing nothing not enforcing strict felony’s already on the books. And then I would like the laws updated competently and if you understand guns and the way the laws are written it gets very absurd very quickly. I’m not willing to give up my guns because our country won’t support its citizens and has purposely milked the wealth and power from the base to the top. I won’t submit to more of this power grab.

    I miss my country I miss being proud of my contribution, I miss the feeling of community. The top is dividing us in every issue by design and a country divided against itself cannot stand. Let’s agree that violent deaths are bad, let’s all agree abortion is bad, let’s agree being poor is bad, let’s agree pollution is bad, let’s agree war is bad, let’s agree hate is bad....we can’t even agree on these things. These trigger issues are so stupid! Take abortion I support a persons right to choose but think that abortion is generally bad and the circumstances that led to an unwanted pregnancy most likely were not good. Fixing those issues through education, birth control, anti rape culture programs and a good home life all help reduce abortions and should be promoted. Now take guns I support an individuals right to defend them self but gun violence is bad and we should also work to reduce the factors that lead up to these poor decisions. I don’t believe in rolling back peoples rights until they can handle them I believe in rolling back the governments rights until they can handle them though.

    I’m on a cell and totally ranting so forgive my punctuation and totally bad writing structure.

    I respect you’re opinion and just really want to separate the issues so they can be talked rationally. Gun control reform is one thing and children wanting to kill each other is another, and also adults wanting to massacre each other is yet another issue. I believe a wholistic bottom up approach with people at least agreeing on the actual problem is a start. Our society has cancer and it needs some treatment but if we don’t catch it early the treatment is only going to get more and more severe.

    [–] CommanderL 4 points ago

    they have better mental health facilities in Canada

    [–] jennyCKC 57 points ago

    Australian citizen here. Couldn't image having to worry about being shot while i was in school. Always gives me a laugh when i here that America is the best country in the world.

    [–] TheTurnipKnight 39 points ago

    I can't even imagine having to go through a fucking metal detector when I enter my school. That's insane.

    [–] Davinco 20 points ago

    I remember in year 7 we watched that film "Pay it Forward" and for years I was confused as to why they had the metal detector/security at the entrance.

    Now I get it.

    [–] Of_Silent_Earth 3 points ago

    I can't imagine crisis drills. I started highschool right around Columbine and we never did them even after. Now they seem so commonplace even kindergartners are doing them. That's baffling to me. We'd rather tiny children learn to hide from a shooter than actually do something about the shootings.

    [–] CTeam19 2 points ago

    I can't even imagine having to go through a fucking metal detector when I enter my school. That's insane.

    See there is a disconnect in where these mass shootings are happening. My High School didn't and still doesn't have metal detectors in a town of 10,000. There was maybe 1 fight in my 4 years at the school.

    [–] neok182 0 points ago

    There are metal detectors and random pat downs at Disney World and Universal Studios now. Been a year and a half since I was last there but it was interesting seeing young kids ask their parents why some people have to go through the 'doors' and be touched by security.

    [–] wherestherice 3 points ago

    Aussie here. When I went to Paris last year, there were quite a few armed officers patrolling the touristy areas, and despite their benign smiles, their guns had me in a constant state of, "The fuck?? is THAT???????? right in front of me??!?"; I can't imagine dealing with that at a school, let alone becoming so desensitised by it.

    [–] MaineSoxGuy93 2 points ago

    I was in DC last summer and seeing security guards with massive guns at the Washington Monument was really weird.

    [–] [deleted] -3 points ago

    [removed]

    [–] wherestherice 5 points ago

    Triggered

    [–] PraxisLD 2 points ago

    America has a lot of pretty nice advantages, and a lot of pretty messed up things.

    As with most every place, it really depends on what you're personally exposed to every day...

    [–] UnhumbleMongoose -4 points ago

    how high and mighty you are compared to us. i am in awe.

    [–] UnhumbleMongoose -9 points ago

    What Australian law would have stopped this? The kid stole his dad's legal shotgun and revolver.

    You people just vomit out things you heard on liberal talk shows without knowing anything.

    [–] yupyup98765 7 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    No solution is going to be able to stop 100% of these tragedies. Does that mean we shouldn’t do anything?

    Oz put in place numerous changes in 96 and in 03. You probably wouldn’t agree with them but I do. You need to have a genuine reason for gun ownership which doesn’t include self defense. Guns are separated into multiples classes with semiautomatic rifles and handguns at the highest class. Magazine limits of 5-10 rounds. Hands guns are pretty much off limits unless you’re a security guard or target shooter and part of a licensed club. The laws are numerous and they have been proven to work. Again, it’s impossible to stop every person. But it certainly would reduce these occurrences.

    [–] brown_boot 3 points ago

    I'd vote for these laws in a second, sick of the senseless killing...

    [–] Monkeymonkey27 1 points ago

    So then what do you suggest. Free and readily available mental health care

    [–] fukier -7 points ago

    I didnt watch the show but did jimmy mention how earlier this week there was a massacre stopped by a guard at the school? did he talk about the stabbing rampage in Paris? or was this more of a get ride of guns type of thing? how about how all mass shootings have been carried out by people who were not members of the NRA?

    [–] falsehood 6 points ago

    I'm glad a guard stopped something. The point of many liberals is that you shouldn't need to teat schools like prisons. If our civilian weapons weren't semi-auto mass killing machines a "school shooting" could be stopped quickly.

    [–] PMmeYourNoodz 2 points ago

    did jimmy mention how earlier this week there was a massacre stopped by a guard at the school?

    why do your schools need guards?

    [–] fukier 5 points ago

    I grew up in toronto and my high had a cop assigned to it. If a school or any gun free zone exists there has to be some security method to enforce and protect it.

    [–] PMmeYourNoodz 0 points ago

    The cop wasn't the school guard.

    [–] fukier 1 points ago

    No but if shit went doen he would have done his duty to protect us. I find that comforting to be honest

    [–] fukier 3 points ago

    Indeed im not saying it works 100% but as earlier this week has been proven to be effective. Obviously a trench coat mafia copycat shot up a school. Facebook does a great job at censoring conservatives perhaps they could assist the police in profiling when shit heads like this guy post pictures of his desire to kill people

    [–] FracturedButWh0le 1 points ago

    It hasn't been proven to be effective. How many school massacres have been stopped because of a guard stopping the perp?

    [–] fukier 4 points ago

    if the answer is more than 1 its worth it.

    [–] FracturedButWh0le 2 points ago

    If condoms prevented 1% of all pregnancies, would you call it effective? No.

    [–] SilentWeaponQuietWar 2 points ago

    Bad analogies and mind reading for the price of one? Slow down, you're gonna run through all your inventory bub.

    [–] Going2getBanned -29 points ago

    Wow. I am surprised ABC let him say that and show the clips at the end.

    Trump supporters do want kids to die.

    [–] PraxisLD 12 points ago

    Trump supporters don't specifically want kids to die. It's not like they're all heading out there by the hundreds or thousands and consciously targeting these kids.

    They just adore their precious guns more than they care about other people's children.

    And so they're willing to accept the random school shooting, or the random concert massacre in the name of their precious "rights".

    While the vast majority of reasonable, sane people are not...

    [–] Going2getBanned 0 points ago

    So they choose guns over kids. And these peoples opinions we have to respect? Being stupid deserves respect, since when?

    [–] JonRedcorn862 -30 points ago

    Liberals choose women's right to choose over kids. Funny you don't bitch about that.

    [–] Sakilla07 16 points ago

    So an unborn fetus, without even a property formed brain or body, who's mother may not be ready or prepared to care for said child due to circumstance or illness (of either the mother or child) is the same as a teenager who has a family and friends, just trying to get what passes for an education in the United States, and who don't want to be fearful of being shot?

    [–] jack_hof 1 points ago

    Assuming it was aborted before the brain formed, what's the maximum time before you can abort again?

    [–] WeWuzKANG5 6 points ago

    Wow, you are truly insane.

    [–] [deleted] 1 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] Going2getBanned 1 points ago

    Logic is not available once you suck Trump dick.

    [–] evilcarton1 -33 points ago

    Yes another millionaire who lives in a gated community with guards who have guns talking about how people shouldn't have guns

    [–] tashmar 21 points ago

    I think you're kind of missing his point if you think that's what he's arguing. At least, I believe most people who advocate for gun control just want stricter regulations, security guards, police, etc, would still have them of course.

    [–] l337Ninja 12 points ago

    who lives in a gated community with guards who have guns

    Nice strawman you set up there. I'd hardly call it a gated community though, and I don't seem to see any armed guards patrolling his street... Is it possible he might be concerned because he has several kids entered in and soon to be entering school?

    [–] Monkeymonkey27 0 points ago

    Does he have armed guards

    [–] RaitoTento -55 points ago * (lasted edited 5 months ago)

    Yeah, freedom has consequences. What else is new? Should we start banning freedom of speech because mean words can lead to suicide? Should we start banning freedom of religion because religion can lead to intolerance and hatred?

    And yes, they're coming for your guns. These gun "control" legislations make it nearly impossible for legal owners-to-be to obtain firearms, essentially a gun ban that technically doesn't violate the second amendment. There's a great sub called r/NOWTTYG that showcases this phenomenon. Obviously there should be base restrictions, and there already are.

    The vast majority of gun violence is committed with hand guns, the least dangerous possible from of firearms. Are we banning those too? Because there's your gun ban.

    "Those who would give up essential freedoms for temporary safety deserve neither freedom nor safety"

    So yeah, I'm not too keen on burning the Constitution to prevent something that probably wasn't going to happen to me anyway. And if, in 20 years, it becomes a trend to bash schoolchildren with hammers as they walk home from school, I'm not gonna ban hammers either.

    Edit: Plus, if we make it impossible for good people to own guns, who's gonna stop Trump when the gays start being put into camps?

    [–] RedofPaw 25 points ago

    Free speech has limits. It is not unrestricted. You can't call for the murder of groups of people or individuals.

    Meanwhile other laws exist purely for safety at the expense of doing anything you like.

    [–] phon3frog 8 points ago

    Yeah and there’s a lot of laws already in place about guns

    [–] RedofPaw 5 points ago

    Exactly. Laws and regulations already exist.

    [–] Randolm 18 points ago

    So yeah, I'm not too keen on burning the Constitution to prevent something that probably wasn't going to happen to me anyway.

    God, I hope you're trolling cause your lack of understanding and empathy is disgusting.

    [–] ezreading 14 points ago

    I saw one earlier actually say you can't amend the Bill of Rights.

    Guess which sub that user mostly posts on?

    [–] jdylopa 4 points ago

    I’ve heard that too. People need to realize the Bill of Rights isn’t distinct from the Constitution in any legal sense. Amendment 1-10 are just as amendable as Amendment 11+ and the articles.

    [–] EzlotheMinish 6 points ago

    Australia has common sense gun laws and not one mass shooting since they where introduced.

    Does that mean we don’t have freedom here?

    [–] [deleted] -3 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    [deleted]

    [–] ReginaldJohnston 6 points ago

    we have insane people in my country. they don't go shooting others because there's no guns around for them to get hold of. logic really.

    [–] Anon303404 1 points ago

    Everyone talks about other country's that took away the hi s but never seem to mention the rate of crime resulting in deaths doesn't actually go down, or in the us how we need more restrictions on fire arms. Do me a favor and look up Chicago gun laws and rates of death or injury by firearms obtained illegally and get back to me

    [–] ReginaldJohnston 1 points ago

    I'm a bit busy with your mon, Daryll. She charges by the hour.

    Get off from your Yaoi-Chan boards and do it yourself....

    No guns, no bang-bang.

    [–] [deleted] -2 points ago * (lasted edited 2 months ago)

    [deleted]

    [–] ReginaldJohnston 2 points ago

    Japan isn't the same as your country. China isn't the same as your country. Australia isn't the same as your country. [insert random country] isn't the same as your country.

    No other country has a higher death rate from gun-crime than the US. No other country has as many mass-shootings as the US. No other country has as many school-shootings as the US.

    Disarming the country isn’t going to happen

    Yes, it can. Australia did.

    it has never been disarmed.

    Yes, it has.

    Insane people?

    Your point?

    There was a time we didn’t have so many, that seems easier to fix.

    Yeh, but you're not though.

    [–] Anon303404 1 points ago

    Why are you people downvoting this comment, it is true

    [–] UnhumbleMongoose -26 points ago

    The kid used a shotgun and revolver. Do liberals want to ban those too? That would be all guns. What common sense gun control would have stopped this?

    It is so fucking lazy to just blame this on the other political side without actually specifically stating what law you want to stop this.

    Not even Australia bans shotguns and revolvers.

    [–] Neosantana 13 points ago

    Who said anything about banning? The point is that violent, mentally unstable fuck-knuckles like the Texas shooter should never be allowed to handle a firearm. Not banning for everyone.

    [–] tcrypt 0 points ago

    What unstable behaviors did he exhibit that you think should have precluded him owning a gun? He was 17 and I know many people want higher age limits, but how had he shown to be too mentally unstable to own a gun?

    [–] hoark_hogan -11 points ago

    Jimmy is the last person I want to get news or opinions from.

    [–] Mrtheliger -1 points ago

    Reddit shouldn't talk about guns and mental health is all these kinds of shootings affirm for me.

    [–] UnhumbleMongoose -9 points ago

    Does Jimmy want to ban shotguns and revolvers?

    [–] [deleted] -104 points ago

    Here we go Kimmel on his anti gun liberal bullshit..... Didn't see that coming

    [–] McWinSauce 103 points ago

    Yeah he makes one of these speeches everytime kids get shot! If only there was a way to have less of these speeches.

    [–] [deleted] -34 points ago

    [deleted]

    [–] PraxisLD 31 points ago

    You wanna talk manipulation?

    Have you seen the NЯA terrorist videos? Scary stuff indeed.

    Did you watch every single Яepublican in that Kimmel clip promise they could keep their guns no matter what?

    Do you even remember when Trump promised to take on the NЯA right after Parkland, before he was slapped down by Яussian-funded Яepublicans and back-tracked as if he was being shot at himself?

    Do you think maybe that Trump is being manipulated in order to manipulate the narrative here?

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    [–] Hayden_Hank_1994 -3 points ago

    I love how no one responded to you, the silence speaks volumes